What's wrong with new 8- (and 16-) bit games?

When the other folders just won't do!

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Shaun.Bebbington
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What's wrong with new 8- (and 16-) bit games?

Post by Shaun.Bebbington » Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:25 am

Hey hey,

I'm sure that there are a lot of people here who like new games for their Speccy, C64, Atari 2600 and the likes... so I want to hear from people who don't like, or don't want to try new software on old computers or consoles.

Do you think new 8- (and 16-) bit games are a waste of time? Is 'retro' purely about nostalgia for you? Are the newest games (on current-gen consoles) just so much better than anything before that homebrew games feel like simple token efforts to please a minority of retro enthusiasts?

I'm not going to defend "new for old" here - I think that my opinions are fairly well known already... just interested to hear what people have to say.

Any opinions will be appreciated :-)

Regards,

Shaun.
"It is far easier to apologise afterwards than to obtain permission." - Felix Dennis

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oli_lar
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Post by oli_lar » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:11 pm

I think its fantastic people are making new games for old consoles. I've bought all the new games that have been released for PCE and although some are pretty crap (Tired game formats...) Some are pretty good. I like Implode especially.

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Post by psj3809 » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:22 pm

Same here, some are very original, others arent, but either way theyre games with new screens to complete etc.

I created my own Bombjack game (Thanks to someones Speccy editor), all it had was different levels and bomb layouts but i loved the original game and thanks to this editor i created myself a nice little different version.

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The Last Ginja
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Post by The Last Ginja » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:58 pm

I'm beginning to realise it's more about nostaliga to me.

I can sit and play games that I had back in the day, overlooking their faults and still enjoy it. All of the new games on old formats (that I've tried) don't seem to cut it for me.

Next Gen gaming FTW?

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paranoid marvin
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Post by paranoid marvin » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:58 pm

New games simply don't have that same 'magic'

I can appreciate that many skilfull people devote much time to making them , but just like you can put together all the parts of a human body , you simply can't create that smae spark of life
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TMR
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Post by TMR » Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:53 pm

paranoid marvin wrote:I can appreciate that many skilfull people devote much time to making them , but just like you can put together all the parts of a human body , you simply can't create that smae spark of life
So why does this spark of life only come from the 1980s/1990s for you then...?

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Dudley
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Post by Dudley » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:01 pm

paranoid marvin wrote:New games simply don't have that same 'magic'

I can appreciate that many skilfull people devote much time to making them , but just like you can put together all the parts of a human body , you simply can't create that smae spark of life
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Crunchy
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Post by Crunchy » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:16 pm

New games not only lack the "magic", they lack everything else too.
If somebody brought out a genuine and original homebrew killer app for one of the old machines I'd be interested in playing it. I'm talking serious originality here, not a copy of Thrust for the Atari 2600 etc etc. Unfortunately, all the homebrew I've ever seen has been weak in gaming terms or there's already a better version available on some other system.
New releases of original IP on the old machines also have the problem of having to compete with that machine's entire back catalogue. Why play an amateur Megadrive rpg release when I can play a professionally produced one that already exists?
This sort of homebrew will only ever interest the diehard followers of a given machine or the dedicated "retro and retro only" crowd. For folk like me, the gamers who don't see the need to put the word "Retro" before "Gamer" every time they crank up a megadrive, there's simply never anything there in homebrew to find properly interesting.

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Crunchy
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Post by Crunchy » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:23 pm

Dudley wrote:
paranoid marvin wrote:New games simply don't have that same 'magic'

I can appreciate that many skilfull people devote much time to making them , but just like you can put together all the parts of a human body , you simply can't create that smae spark of life
Blast Arena Advance says you're a liar.
The OP quite clearly states 8bit and 16bit machines are what's being discussed here. For those who can't read a few machines are even mentioned.
The GBA is hardly a retro machine. Worth pointing out since you felt the need to jump in and wrongly call somebody a liar.

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Shaun.Bebbington
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Post by Shaun.Bebbington » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:52 am

Crunchy wrote:New games not only lack the "magic", they lack everything else too.
If somebody brought out a genuine and original homebrew killer app for one of the old machines I'd be interested in playing it. I'm talking serious originality here, not a copy of Thrust for the Atari 2600 etc etc. Unfortunately, all the homebrew I've ever seen has been weak in gaming terms or there's already a better version available on some other system.
New releases of original IP on the old machines also have the problem of having to compete with that machine's entire back catalogue. Why play an amateur Megadrive rpg release when I can play a professionally produced one that already exists?
This sort of homebrew will only ever interest the diehard followers of a given machine or the dedicated "retro and retro only" crowd. For folk like me, the gamers who don't see the need to put the word "Retro" before "Gamer" every time they crank up a megadrive, there's simply never anything there in homebrew to find properly interesting.
Some good points there, thanks.

Regards,

Shaun.
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Knight Lore
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Post by Knight Lore » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:24 am

Tricky to answer.

Firstly, I have never tried any modern 8-bit game (modern in the sense that it was programmed and released after 1990, which is my own yardstick regarding the end of the 8-bit heyday).
There are a number of reasons for this. Firstly, I am not willing to pay for the physical version of such games, as I don't own any retro machines. Secondly, although nostalgia plays an important part in my love of retro gaming, there is also that strange, elusive unknown quantity which is hard to define. It's all about the 'feel' of a game.

The simple test is this -

Give me a list of new games mixed with old and I'll download them all and play them. I can guarantee that I will be able to tell, after maybe 20 minutes each of playing those games, which were released in the 80's and which were released in the last 8 years or so.

(The tricky thing here of course, is finding old genuine 8-bit games that I haven't heard of - but if that obstacle can be overcome, this could be an interesting experiment and maybe a great in-house challenge for one of the RG staff which could be written up as a feature).

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Post by psj3809 » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:51 am

Well yes many of these latest games you can pay for a tape version (which some people like doing) or a small amount for an emulator image, often 99p or 1.50 which is nothing.

Have a go at the 3 level demo of Farmer Jack from the archive at WOS. Great Mr Do! version, the sequel, Farmer Jack and the Hedge Monkeys is free and can be downloaded and is the Speccy version of Ladybug.

I personally like the Speccy graphics/gameplay/sound and enjoy seeing some new games on the machine. The ones coming out on the Speccy are very polished and if they were released back then they would be Crash Smashes.

Just as i enjoy finding some old Speccy game from 1988 i had never tried before i also like playing a brand new game from some of the talented authors out there.

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oli_lar
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Post by oli_lar » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:37 am

It seems for some people the joy of retro gaming comes from the nostalgia & memories stirred by games they played when they were a kid, not the actual game, and hence the newly released games won't have such memories attatched and won't be that enjoyed by these people.

For other people they just prefer older games because they had originality or its an entirely new console to them (I never owned a PC Engine back in the day..).

Many new retro games don't seem to get far past the 'demo scene' stage - like Meteor Blaster DX for the PCE, it was a tired format (asteroids...) and offered nothing new, but proved new CD based games for the PCE can be developed.

Implode (Same developer, Mindrec) was a semi-new format and as such has originality and more playability. Its more of a fully fledged game. I hope Mindrec continue and create some quality, rounded games.

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Post by psj3809 » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:41 am

oli_lar wrote:It seems for some people the joy of retro gaming comes from the nostalgia & memories stirred by games they played when they were a kid, not the actual game, and hence the newly released games won't have such memories attatched and won't be that enjoyed by these people.
Agree with that, we all have our favourites we like going back to even though there might be a better version of it on the PS2 etc.

I personally like the Speccy graphics/gameplay/sound so i do like discovering other games i never tried back then and of course new games.

Of course current games have a million times better graphics and sound but often the gameplay isnt that great. For me i just dont have the time to load up a PC game and play it for hours, a quick blast on a few Speccy games (and new Speccy games) fits me ideal.

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Turrican
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Post by Turrican » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:56 pm

Gaming has changed from back then, obviously and I also think because of that you can't really have people relate to these new games for older formats.

Many people will have these consoles stored away and may not want to bother getting the box out, set up the machine and then play it. Considering that flash is more than capable of producing games of a higher quality, some people would rather use flash than make the effort.

It's good to see that people are willing to put the time in to make games for the old formats as they once were, much like some DJ's still using vinyl, but in a day were emulators are more popular than ever mixed with a throwaway society, it's just too much work for little enough reward IMO.
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