Is the forum in decline?

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pratty
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by pratty » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:59 am

psj3809 wrote:
Tue Sep 24, 2019 4:45 am
I can see why they shut all that stuff down, i did enjoy lots of the controversial stuff i must admit but at times the Off topic arguments was bigger than any retro chat here. Nowadays Facebook is more popular for discussions than forums so if i want to argue about Brexit/Labour/Tories/Religion theres plenty of places to argue on Facebook about that rather than a retro games forum.

And yeah lots of those threads just caused huge arguments/reported posts/hassle for the mods etc so you can see why they've acted like that. But plenty of other places to argue about white characters in Witcher if you really are that bored to do that
I think you and Matt are getting hung up on the example and missing the principle? The Witcher 3 criticism just sprang to mind, but there are plenty of other examples. The point is if political activism has a detrimental effect on a person's gaming experience, they cannot discuss it here on a gaming forum. Imagine your favourite game series being drastically altered or discontinued because political activists deemed it 'problematic'. I don't think it would be too unreasonable on a games forum to express your discontent and concerns regarding that. I would be willing to risk being offended by what you had to say. :)

Sure you could do that on Facebook, and that's the point. You can more freely discuss retro games on facebook, and you can more freely discuss current events on facebook, so many ex-forum members probably asked themselves why come back here at all? Even if you think a retro games forum isn't the appropriatte place to discuss current events of a political or religious nature, even in it's off-topic section, the blanket ban extends into the games section.

And yes, some people want to discuss aspects of gaming others find trivial and boring, fair play to them I say. Threads that aren't popular will die a natural death, telling the initial poster to go to Facebook isn't going to increase the activity on this forum.
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Tom_Baker
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Tom_Baker » Tue Sep 24, 2019 4:20 pm

I wouldn't say the forum is in decline.It is pretty much dead.There is to much tumble weed on here.
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Matt_B
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Matt_B » Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:20 pm

I addressed The Witcher specifically, in order to set the record straight, as some people have been attributing views to the developers that they don't actually hold.

More generally, that the solitary example offered has little basis in fact rather undermines the argument it's supposed to back up. Indeed, I think you'd struggle to find a major developer taking an extreme political stance that you'd be likely to cop a ban for hate speech on here merely for supporting.

Games getting changed due to political interference is real though. I'd be a bit more concerned about morally crusading politicians and media-induced moral panics than mere 'activists' though. The latter rarely seen to achieve anything but I can think of a lot of games that have been censored, either actively or pre-emptively with the localization.

Anyway, I'll agree that there are many discussions about the politics of games to be had, but I'll respect the rules by conducting them elsewhere.

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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Antiriad2097 » Wed Sep 25, 2019 12:56 am

Is it safe to discuss forum politics?
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by pratty » Wed Sep 25, 2019 2:17 am

Matt_B wrote:
Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:20 pm
I addressed The Witcher specifically, in order to set the record straight, as some people have been attributing views to the developers that they don't actually hold.

More generally, that the solitary example offered has little basis in fact rather undermines the argument it's supposed to back up. Indeed, I think you'd struggle to find a major developer taking an extreme political stance that you'd be likely to cop a ban for hate speech on here merely for supporting.
It is a fact that The Witcher 3 drew criticism for the lack of racial diversity. My mistake to say "all white" if that's what you're referring to as that's not literally the case, but I wasn't inferring some deliberate and specific "whites only" political stance of the developers, more the absence of one actually. Again you miss the point though, it's not even just a case of wanting to support a political stance, you cannot talk about about the political aspects of a game or it's development/consumption at all.
Matt_B wrote:
Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:20 pm
Games getting changed due to political interference is real though. I'd be a bit more concerned about morally crusading politicians and media-induced moral panics than mere 'activists' though. The latter rarely seen to achieve anything but I can think of a lot of games that have been censored, either actively or pre-emptively with the localization.
I would and did include media (specifically games journalists) as potential political activists. Politicians too of course, and probably many games developers and publishers as well.
Matt_B wrote:
Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:20 pm
, I'll agree that there are many discussions about the politics of games to be had, but I'll respect the rules by conducting them elsewhere.


Fine, but that's potential forum activity we could be having here, going elsewhere. The likelihood of extremist political views being expressed in gaming chat is pretty low, but even the mildest of political comment is equally banned. To even lament the political storm in a tea cup surrounding a game is probably a grey area at best given the current state of the rules.
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NickThorpe
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by NickThorpe » Wed Sep 25, 2019 12:21 pm

See, here's the thing: talking about politics is something I do. I studied politics at university, I have been politically active and will occasionally post about politics on social media. I've rarely done it here, because I'd rather not get into arguments with people who are or could be my customers, but I'm certainly not against the discussion of politics on the whole.

However, I do feel that the ban on political discussion here is probably for the best. I have a few reasons for this:

Firstly, the aforementioned problem with hate speech. Clearly some people didn't think they were breaking that rule, but from our perspective, they were. It's not a great look for anyone to be hosting some of the rhetoric that was being flung about here, but especially not a global media company. While the members responsible were banned, the current policy leaves no room for ambiguity in case of further incidents, and reduces the risk of them happening in the first place.

Secondly, as much as I hate to say it, the membership couldn't be trusted to act responsibly. The Manchester terror attack thread was locked, and Darran mentioned that rule-breaking had occurred. I locked the London one, noting that much of the chat was in violation of the AUP (and indeed, users in the thread had already predicted it'd be locked - they clearly knew rules were being broken). I then warned people not to use the general election thread to resurrect the locked threads, and what happened? They flat out ignored that warning, and I ended up having to delete it. Light touch moderation wasn't cutting it.

Lastly, I've seen exactly how these discussions play out - both here in the past, and at the other place in the present. Restricting speech may not necessarily be the best thing for a community, but I don't think that the name-calling and bitterness that political threads generate is either. It was bad enough two years ago, and the world has become even more polarised since.

You may not particularly like that, and that's fine, but the policy won't be changing.
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Shinobi
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Shinobi » Wed Sep 25, 2019 1:45 pm

Very well said Nick I did make a similar post yesterday and thought against it. Your writing and is tidier and mine a little scrambled in grammer

I mean how often have you read/heard something and thought, 'Yes, that's it exactly!' you saw exactly what the author/speaker saw but he was able to 'voice' it better!

Just wanted to add regarding the other place several members deleted their accounts, the sites creator one of the nicest guys you could meet told them on numerous occasions “to act like the adults they where supposed to be” his warnings where ignored & he was going to delete the forum. The forum was taken over and he relinquished his mod status.

The new forums main ethos was Politics and freedom of free speech no matter how vulgar your viewpoint was allowed. This drove the remaining members away and we where left with the same 5 members insulting one another.

The abuse took a sinister turn with pictures of members and their family’s being posted on the forum..

I deleted myself from that forum so I’m not sure it is the same glad politics will remained banned
Last edited by Shinobi on Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sephiroth81
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Sephiroth81 » Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:47 pm

I now post my gaming comments on here, and spill my political bile and belittle knuckleheads on the 'other' forum.

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Matt_B
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Matt_B » Wed Sep 25, 2019 5:28 pm

pratty wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 2:17 am
It is a fact that The Witcher 3 drew criticism for the lack of racial diversity. My mistake to say "all white" if that's what you're referring to as that's not literally the case, but I wasn't inferring some deliberate and specific "whites only" political stance of the developers, more the absence of one actually. Again you miss the point though, it's not even just a case of wanting to support a political stance, you cannot talk about about the political aspects of a game or it's development/consumption at all.
Sure, it drew criticism for being whiter than a country music convention, and it's certainly that. However, in Poland, that's your audience; that's what the devs said if anyone actually read the interviews with them. You can watch the hilariously low budget TV adaptation that was made there and see the characters being portrayed by white people with face paint, because where the heck were they going to find suitably ethnic actresses? It was a very manufactured controversy and pretty much evaporated when the DLC came out with a bunch of rather more visible non-white characters in it.
Fine, but that's potential forum activity we could be having here, going elsewhere. The likelihood of extremist political views being expressed in gaming chat is pretty low, but even the mildest of political comment is equally banned. To even lament the political storm in a tea cup surrounding a game is probably a grey area at best given the current state of the rules.
To be brutally frank, let it go elsewhere.

It'd be nice if we could talk a bit about politics on here, but you've got to remember which people peed in that pool.

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Sephiroth81
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Sephiroth81 » Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:35 pm

Matt_B wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 5:28 pm

It'd be nice if we could talk a bit about politics on here, but you've got to remember which people peed in that pool.
Theres really not that much to talk about these days in politics anyway, its all gone eerily quiet. :wink:

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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by pratty » Fri Sep 27, 2019 11:57 am

Sephiroth81 wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:35 pm
Theres really not that much to talk about these days in politics anyway, its all gone eerily quiet. :wink:
I was actually planning a trip to Hong Kong round about now but like the procrastinator I am I didn't get around to it. Glad I didn't now.

This is the state the world gets itself into when the Retro Gamer Forum isn't sorting this stuff out. :lol:
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sscott
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by sscott » Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:43 am

I miss the great days here way back. Lots of active threads and always a new mid level event organised by our members to look forward to. I worry a lot about the hyper polarised political world we now live in and the endless echo chambers we get stuck in now.
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Shinobi
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Shinobi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:06 pm

A member of the forum who preferred to remain illiterate said about the banned members "I no'd them alryt, an I foned Darren an narkd them up!I hope they brakes roks in the hot sun and don get out of the Canteen til there 65!" Then they’d really be Retro..
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Shinobi
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by Shinobi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:14 pm

Is that good politically motivated Retro forum busier then here as it’s seems to be Members only?

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DPrinny
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Re: Is the forum in decline?

Post by DPrinny » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:40 pm

*Pokes his head in*

Don't really post on forums that much anymore, very little worth typing about these days.
the other place seems to be a waste land of shitposting, I think ive already said that
Politics can get as bent as almost all politicians.

*Buggers off again in a cloud of what could be called "Whimsy", or might be a fart*

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