Atari vs C64 // was: 8-Bit Computer Poll

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Best 8-Bit

ZX Spectrum
109
41%
Commodore 64
121
46%
Amstrad CPC 464
25
10%
BBC Micro
8
3%
 
Total votes: 263

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Xesh
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Post by Xesh » Wed May 02, 2007 8:32 pm

TMR wrote:
neuromancer wrote:The Beeb was a technically impressive machine
Are we talking about the same hardware here...?.........Want to be more specific about which part of the hardware was impressive...?
Which of the other computers mentioned could support co-processors natively? Which of them could be networked at a time when even the PC was as rare as hen's teeth? Also the Beeb was designed to use various other ROMs to expand its capabilities, and these could be fitted internally without any other expansion modules.

There's also the fact that the Beeb had only 32K of RAM compared to the others which had 48/64K (or more in some cases). Despite this handicap the games were as good as anything the other machines could do. It was only at the end of its life when the 64 and 128K models were released. These were then superseded by the Master range of computers.

My mate had a Spectrum and I remember him moaning about various things about it. He was especially annoyed at the 16K RAM pack that kept having to be repositioned if the computer was knocked at all (sometimes even when it wasn't).

I can't comment on the other two computers as I didn't know anyone with them at the time.

An interesting side note on this is that the Amstrad was originally planned to be used with a 6502 CPU the same as the Beeb. The Z80 was used in the end because it was easier to get hold of, as well as being cheaper, and the developers could already program it.

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Post by beanz » Wed May 02, 2007 8:42 pm

Xesh wrote:
TMR wrote:
neuromancer wrote:The Beeb was a technically impressive machine
Are we talking about the same hardware here...?.........Want to be more specific about which part of the hardware was impressive...?

My mate had a Spectrum and I remember him moaning about various things about it. He was especially annoyed at the 16K RAM pack that kept having to be repositioned if the computer was knocked at all (sometimes even when it wasn't).
Your confusing the speccy with the ZX81, no 16k ram pack for the speccy . There was a 32k for the 16k Spectrum to bring it up to the 48k but they were rare as most memory upgrades were done internally.

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Post by klx300r » Wed May 02, 2007 10:13 pm

I still adore my 64 :D

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Antiriad2097
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Post by Antiriad2097 » Thu May 03, 2007 1:09 am

Opa-Opa wrote:
RetroRik wrote:
Is there anybody here that had both at one time or another and therefore don't really have a bias.?

What do these people really think.?
I had both at the time (CBM64 & ZX Spectrum) but the Speccy had something "extra" that the 64 couldn't reproduce..
I know some games were far better on the 64 than on the speccy but it still had a charm and a user base that made it stand above anything else around at the time..
I also had both and came to the opposite conclusion. While the Speccy had a curious 'Britishness' about it, I ultimately prefer the C64.
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Post by darthy » Thu May 03, 2007 5:25 am

if the vote was carried out on an american forum the spectrum would probably get 0 votes so really it should be called "most popular 8-bit in europe", the c64 would win by a mile if it was a world wide thing.

shame my bbc would get get pap votes wherever it was held :lol:
aye

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sirclive1
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Post by sirclive1 » Thu May 03, 2007 5:27 am

I have a 16k ram pack for the spectrum ! & a 32k as well

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P-Head
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Post by P-Head » Thu May 03, 2007 5:46 am

I'm backing the Beeb

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Post by psj3809 » Thu May 03, 2007 5:57 am

Xesh wrote:Which of the other computers mentioned could support co-processors natively? Which of them could be networked at a time when even the PC was as rare as hen's teeth? Also the Beeb was designed to use various other ROMs to expand its capabilities, and these could be fitted internally without any other expansion modules.

There's also the fact that the Beeb had only 32K of RAM compared to the others which had 48/64K (or more in some cases). Despite this handicap the games were as good as anything the other machines could do. It was only at the end of its life when the 64 and 128K models were released. These were then superseded by the Master range of computers
Who gives a monkeys about the techy mumbo jumbo. Betamax was better than VHS but because everyone bought VHS Betamax was totally forgotton.

The Beeb didnt have many killer games. The mags called Retro Gamer not 'Retro Techy Spec'. The C64/Speccy and Amstrad had a ton more better games. Dont give two hoots if the Speccy didnt "support co-processors natively?" , it had great games

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Post by psj3809 » Thu May 03, 2007 6:00 am

Emperor Fossil wrote: The first time I tried a spectrum emulator, it took me a while to realise that the way the colors of moving objects affected the background colors (or vice versa) wasn't an emulation bug. And I tried a bunch of emulators in search of smooth scrolling.

Still, the speccy is wining the poll, so I guess it touched the hearts of many fans.
Depends on the games. Software companies knew that if they released a game despite colour clash etc it would still sell 1000's. Check out Lightforce on the Speccy, tons of colour no colour clash. For scrolling Flying Shark was smooth as a babys bottom.

Usual argument - C64 blockier graphics but more colourful and better sound, Speccy - english and smoother graphics but less colour and not so good sound (until 128k arrived)

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Post by SirClive » Thu May 03, 2007 6:30 am

darthy wrote:if the vote was carried out on an american forum the spectrum would probably get 0 votes so really it should be called "most popular 8-bit in europe", the c64 would win by a mile if it was a world wide thing.

shame my bbc would get get pap votes wherever it was held :lol:
It is an international forum as the mag has an international readership.
What other evidence do you need that the Spectrum is the best kick-ass super computer that the world has ever seen?
Image

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Emperor Fossil
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Post by Emperor Fossil » Thu May 03, 2007 7:22 am

psj3809 wrote:
Emperor Fossil wrote: The first time I tried a spectrum emulator, it took me a while to realise that the way the colors of moving objects affected the background colors (or vice versa) wasn't an emulation bug. And I tried a bunch of emulators in search of smooth scrolling.

Still, the speccy is wining the poll, so I guess it touched the hearts of many fans.
Depends on the games. Software companies knew that if they released a game despite colour clash etc it would still sell 1000's. Check out Lightforce on the Speccy, tons of colour no colour clash. For scrolling Flying Shark was smooth as a babys bottom.

Usual argument - C64 blockier graphics but more colourful and better sound, Speccy - english and smoother graphics but less colour and not so good sound (until 128k arrived)
Yeah, the speccy version of Flying Shark is pretty good. The scrolling is reasonably smooth, though it slows down when objects start flying about. The sprite movement is OK. But I've yet to see a speccy game that moves anywhere near as smoothly as many 64 games, with both scrolling and sprites moving silky smooth.

Light Force, though... urk. I'd never call that a game with tons of color I'm afraid. Plus it has color clash. Any yellow parts of the enemies turn cyan or purple as they move over the planets. It's just that it's hard to notice because everything moves so jerky.

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Post by neuromancer » Thu May 03, 2007 7:33 am

psj3809 wrote:
Xesh wrote:Which of the other computers mentioned could support co-processors natively? Which of them could be networked at a time when even the PC was as rare as hen's teeth? Also the Beeb was designed to use various other ROMs to expand its capabilities, and these could be fitted internally without any other expansion modules.

There's also the fact that the Beeb had only 32K of RAM compared to the others which had 48/64K (or more in some cases). Despite this handicap the games were as good as anything the other machines could do. It was only at the end of its life when the 64 and 128K models were released. These were then superseded by the Master range of computers
Who gives a monkeys about the techy mumbo jumbo. Betamax was better than VHS but because everyone bought VHS Betamax was totally forgotton.

The Beeb didnt have many killer games. The mags called Retro Gamer not 'Retro Techy Spec'. The C64/Speccy and Amstrad had a ton more better games. Dont give two hoots if the Speccy didnt "support co-processors natively?" , it had great games
I'd have to say that the Beeb had possibly the mother of all killer apps - Elite...

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Post by Antiriad2097 » Thu May 03, 2007 7:43 am

psj3809 wrote:Speccy - english
Except most of them were made in the Timex factory in Scotland :roll:

Which is why the Americans wouldn't vote for a Spectrum - they never had them. Instead they received the licensed Timex 1000 branded version.
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Post by psj3809 » Thu May 03, 2007 7:51 am

Emperor Fossil wrote:Light Force, though... urk. I'd never call that a game with tons of color I'm afraid. Plus it has color clash. Any yellow parts of the enemies turn cyan or purple as they move over the planets. It's just that it's hard to notice because everything moves so jerky.
Come on it does have tons of colour ! The colour clash is hardly noticeable at all, never heard anyone say the comment you have.

Just a shame the games pretty poor though ! Could have been so good but the alien ships are boring as hell. Not a bad little shooter though

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The Master
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Post by The Master » Thu May 03, 2007 8:15 am

Come on people, the Beeb's at least got to beat the pissing Amstrad...!

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