Atari vs C64 // was: 8-Bit Computer Poll

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Best 8-Bit

ZX Spectrum
109
41%
Commodore 64
121
46%
Amstrad CPC 464
25
10%
BBC Micro
8
3%
 
Total votes: 263

oswald
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Post by oswald » Wed May 16, 2007 12:19 pm

psj3809 wrote:The vast number of readers of Retro Gamer are based in the UK and then Europe. The most popular machines in the UK (And Europe) are the ones listed.

I mean what next ? Moaning the Oric isnt there or the Dragon ?

The C64 might have sold millions more and the Speccy might not have been popular with the 'rich' people of Hungary who could afford the C64 but most of these votes and polls are based on the UK and perhaps Europe.

In the UK it was either Speccy/C64 or Amstrad, not really Atari/Oric/Dragon hence theyre not on the list.
the home computer era in hungary started in around 85. and the majority who could afford a computer had simply a c64. it was not the question of this or that or 'rich'ness, the homecomputer was the c64 literally.

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dr_bob
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Post by dr_bob » Wed May 16, 2007 12:22 pm

psj3809 wrote:The vast number of readers of Retro Gamer are based in the UK and then Europe. The most popular machines in the UK (And Europe) are the ones listed.

I mean what next ? Moaning the Oric isnt there or the Dragon ?

The C64 might have sold millions more and the Speccy might not have been popular with the 'rich' people of Hungary who could afford the C64 but most of these votes and polls are based on the UK and perhaps Europe.

In the UK it was either Speccy/C64 or Amstrad, not really Atari/Oric/Dragon hence they're not on the list.
Hang on , you're at cross purposes there
" The most popular machines in the UK (And Europe) are the ones listed."
and
"In the UK it was either Speccy/C64 or Amstrad, not really Atari/Oric/Dragon hence theyre not on the list"

So if its a UK only poll fair enough , but if its a UK and Europe one then the BBC and the amstrad wouldnt get a place , and the Atari 8 bits would.

(warning , rambling ahead)
I love the whole retro gaming scene , but one of the things I've learnt to deal with is that the whole experience changes depending on where you grew up .RG , being a UK mag is crazy for the Spectrum ,Commodore and Amstrad , and less so for other machines , as for the majority of their readership , that's what 80's gaming was about .If it was an Irish mag (ha! it would have a reader base of about 3) It would probably be C64, Atari and Spectrum.A German Retro mag would be c64 and Atari 800.A US mag would basically be 120 pages of NES action , followed by a bit of "Genesis" and Snes coverage ;) ).

Ironically now I own a spectrum 48k and a c64 , but not the original machine I had (an Atari 800xl , by the way if anyone out there fancies selling me one ....;)).

Btw I'm guessing the sudden Atari Love is coming from the post over in the forums of atariage.com ..hello lads!
Last edited by dr_bob on Thu May 17, 2007 5:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by gury » Wed May 16, 2007 12:24 pm

Here in slovenia first affordable computers arrived sometime in 1983 or so, and that first computer was ZX Spectrum. Then others came, C64, Atari 8-bit, CPC... Our local magazine (issues 1984 - 1990) always praised Ataris over everything else even if they were not so common than C64 or ZX spectrum. And I am glad I got one, with 128Kb :wink:
You are welcome to visit http://gury.atari8.info/

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Post by gury » Wed May 16, 2007 12:26 pm

dr_bob wrote: So if its a UK only poll fair enough , but if its a UK and Europe one then the BBC and the amstrad wouldnt get a place , and the Atari 8 bits would.

(warning , rambling ahead)
I love the whole retro gaming scene , but one of the things I've learnt to deal with is that the whole experience changes depending on where you grew up .RG , being a UK mag is crazy for the spectrum ,commodore and amstrad , and less so for other machines , as for the majority of their readship , thats what 80's gaming was about .If it was an Irish mag (ha! it would have a readship of about 3) It would probably be C64, Atari and Spectrum.A German Retro mag would be c64 and Atari 800.A US mag would basically be 120 pages of NES action , followed by a bit of "genesis" and snes coverage ;) ).

Ironically now I own a spectrum 48k and a c64 , but not the original machine I had (and Atari 800xl , by the way if anyone out there fancies selling me one ....;)).

Btw I'm guessing the sudden Atari Love is coming from the post over in the forums of atariage.com ..hello lads!
Hello Atari fellow, I am also on AtariAge forum.

Atari Forever 8) :o
You are welcome to visit http://gury.atari8.info/

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Matt_B
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Post by Matt_B » Wed May 16, 2007 12:30 pm

I'd say that the UK market took off in 1981 with the launch of the BBC Micro and ZX81. VIC-20s were fairly common back then too.

I wouldn't say that the C64 was unaffordable. It was just pitched at a significantly higher price than the Spectrum, so the latter represented better value for money to most people. As the 80s went on, the price differential dropped and the C64's share of the market picked up accordingly.

Anyway, for me the decision was easy. The C64 wasn't even launched when I got my Spectrum. :)

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Post by oswald » Wed May 16, 2007 12:32 pm


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Post by potatohead » Wed May 16, 2007 1:50 pm

Hello back!

Yep. I'm from the AA forums. Stumbled onto this site on a lark. Interesting crowd.

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paranoid marvin
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Post by paranoid marvin » Wed May 16, 2007 3:18 pm

Matt_B wrote:I'd say that the UK market took off in 1981 with the launch of the BBC Micro and ZX81. VIC-20s were fairly common back then too.

I wouldn't say that the C64 was unaffordable. It was just pitched at a significantly higher price than the Spectrum, so the latter represented better value for money to most people. As the 80s went on, the price differential dropped and the C64's share of the market picked up accordingly.

Anyway, for me the decision was easy. The C64 wasn't even launched when I got my Spectrum. :)
the C64 was unaffordabe for 99% of the kids at my Comprehensive school
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Mayhem
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Post by Mayhem » Wed May 16, 2007 4:11 pm

Which is somewhat of the point I made in my previous post. I believe there were quite a few C64 owners in my school because they (and their parents) were better off in general and hence could afford it. Not sure that was the reason my parents went that route, afair it was the proper keyboard that was a main reason (as they had already seen the rubber key Speccy from their best friends buying one for their son).
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Post by neuromancer » Wed May 16, 2007 4:22 pm

Mayhem wrote:Which is somewhat of the point I made in my previous post.
...and mine (previous being 5 or 6 posts back) :D

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Allas
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Post by Allas » Wed May 16, 2007 7:00 pm

When I was kid in 1983 I bought my first 800xl. In my classroom only 4 kids had computers, one Z81 Spectrum, one ZX Spectrum 48, and 2 Atari 800XL (included me). All from us, try to program in his own computer only using Basic in the beginning.

Until 1984 Atari produced a lot of games, most of them quality portings, over the C64 versions. As: Frogger, all the family Pacman, Twerps, Astrochase, Bandits!, Choplifter, Galaxian, Microprose flight simulators, Seawolf, Attack of the mutant Camels, Lucasfilm titles, Bristles, Buck Rogers, Donkey Kong family, Flip and Flop, Activision titles, Rally Speedway, Montezuma, Space Shuttle, Wavy Navy, Decathlon, Dropzone, Flak, Frogger 2, Hero, Seven cities of Gold,....... a lot more.

And even more, arcade conversions didn't exist in C64 before 1984 as Space Invaders, Blue Print, Dig Dug, Kangaroo, Capture the flag!, Alley cat, Encounter, Joust, Jungle Hunt, Pole Position, Tennis, Defender, Last Starfighter, ..... a lot more

So, its false than only a couple of games from Atari are better in 1985. Atari had the best versions at least in 70% software produced. In 1985 when loses the developers and market, the quality of software went down, very down.

Until 1991 new companies retook the Atari and show how interesting software could be created, step by step, slowly.

This is a list of features than Atari have in his own stock hardware:

- International Character support built in (not all the people speak english)
- 3 sizes of workscreen: narrow (32 bytes per row, save the memory), standard (40 bytes per row) and widescreen (48 bytes per row, ideal for scrollings).
- Work screen cover all TV screen at the left/right/top/bottom borders.
- Hardware scroll is more flexible and faster. Every row in the screen have his own attribute to scroll. Memory screen mapping is dynamic, ideal for some scroll techniques.
- Cold Reset, Warm Reset and a programable warm reset.
- More Graphic modes. Can be mixing in best flexible way.
- Extra sound audio channel for tape software. Left channel used for data and right channel for audio that is reproduced on the TV. This increase the quality of educative software.
- A palette of 128/256 colors.
- Best designed internal BIOS, OS.
- Autobooteable feature, fast loading, easy to load software.
- Dynamic Memory pointers for programming on Screens, Fonts, extra memory banking....
- Faster CPU
- 128K memory
- POKEY gets better quality sound effects.
- Screen saver
- Internal test program
- Better and fast Basic built-in
- Compatibility since 1978 models.
- High quality SIO designed by the same of USB tech

This is a list of features than C64 have:

- Better handle of 320x200 res
- 8 multicolor Sprites with Y axis
- Better sound chip for music
- Keys can be read individually
- Color map feature.
- Real font of 256 chars.

Anymore to add or explain?
Last edited by Allas on Wed May 16, 2007 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Emperor Fossil
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Post by Emperor Fossil » Wed May 16, 2007 9:48 pm

Well... I'm not too hot on the technical side, but I can say that the c64 has an absolute boatload of games that aren't all stuck in the early '80s.

Which is a pretty big plus for it in my book.

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Post by gury » Thu May 17, 2007 4:18 am

The most important thing is you enjoy your machine of choice. These machines have their own absolute winners and classics.

For Atari 8-bit home computers the new era started after 1990 in Poland, where new Atari scene appeared. The result was new great games, besides other genres, new fantastic 2D platform games were introduced.
You are welcome to visit http://gury.atari8.info/

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Matt_B
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Post by Matt_B » Thu May 17, 2007 4:53 am

paranoid marvin wrote:the C64 was unaffordabe for 99% of the kids at my Comprehensive school
It depends when you're talking about. In 1982, a PAL C64 would have set you back around £400 and you'd be right. There were few kids with that sort of money, and most of those were getting BBC Micros at that time. For everyone else the choice was Spectrum or VIC-20.

By 1985 the C64 cost just £230 which was still a fair bit more than the cheapest Spectrum model (a Spectrum+ was about £130) but was getting much more affordable. I just had a flick through the first issue of Zzap!64 and apparently there had only been half a million C64s sold in the UK by that stage, where the Spectrum had shifted something like four million. The C64 was always playing catch-up in the marketplace, but the ability to import hit games from the US market was a bit of a leveller for it.

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dr_bob
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Post by dr_bob » Thu May 17, 2007 5:13 am

dr_bob wrote:
R.G. , being a UK mag is crazy for the spectrum ,commodore and amstrad , and less so for other machines ......


Btw I'm guessing the sudden Atari Love is coming from the post over in the forums of atariage.com ..hello lads!
Just to clarify (before someone else says it ) RG covers a lot more than just the 80's home computers (asI think it may have looked like I was saying that they don't),but when they do , as they're a UK magazine it is mainly about the spectrum and c64, which is fair enough.

Also it wasn't me that posted re this on AA, honest!.
I do lurk over there though.
,

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