Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

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crusto
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by crusto » Wed Dec 31, 2014 5:04 pm

nakamura wrote:
The Beans wrote:
nakamura wrote:That's frankly stupid.
Not as stupid as claiming Super Mario World is the pinnacle of game design as an undeniable fact. It might be in your opinion but plenty of other people will say otherwise. The game will always be a classic but that doesn't necessarily it mean it will always be a great game. As time moves on so does the perception of taste. Video games aren't timeless. Nothing is. Your opinion is clouding your objectivity I think.
It is the pinnacle of design, it's masterful. The genre hasn't really gone anywhere since it was released bar a few diversions. It's hard, and it's easy. It's creative, clever, open ended and full of things to search for and unlock. The game can be finished in 12-13 levels yet has around 70. There are subtle clues to secrets, clever markers in the level colours, subtle music changes with Yoshi. It even has early collecting cues with the Yoshi coins, 5 in pretty much each level.

I'm confident anyone that knows anything about game design would agree.
Iirc Super Mario World has 96 levels :P
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by Liamh1982 » Wed Dec 31, 2014 6:05 pm

Popular misconception - it has 96 exits i.e. some levels have to be finished in more than one way to count towards 100% completion. These levels are generally marked with a red dot instead of a yellow one on the main world hub.

IIRC there are actually 75 individual and separate levels. Believe me, if I know any game better than I know myself, it's that one!

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crusto
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by crusto » Wed Dec 31, 2014 6:09 pm

I clocked it too back in the day, got all the secrets etc, always thought it was 96. I'm sure that's the number that was banded around back then. That's what's in my head anyway :lol:
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lanky316
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by lanky316 » Thu Jan 01, 2015 7:08 am

The Beans wrote:For something to be "timeless" it has to stay truly relevant.

It just mean Shakespeare's works aren't suddenly going to become the books of choice for young teens.
Really, really bad example to use. For every fad that comes along there are still millions of copies of the Complete Works sold every year, with young people discovering and loving his work all the time. We see various versions of his stuff - whether played straight or an alternate take (The Lion King anyone?) - proving massively popular with every generation. School does it's best to suck the life out of it and sour young people on Shakespeare but it hasn't stopped it being relevant and popular with them and being discovered and enjoyed by youngsters all the time.

You do highlight the big issue under here though, that through our own perceptions we see things in one way and won't realise these things. If a kid only has any knowledge or understanding of certain things it's no surprise they won't necessarily embrace something new to them (even if in cases like this it's older) as they have zero knowledge, understanding or inclination to even try to. A great test case is the Amish, in your teen years you suddenly leave your sheltered life and experience all the real world with all it's mod cons and can choose to live that life or go back to their old life style. The vast majority go back having not been wowed by the things that in our minds are essential and failing to see what's so great about them.

As for our own perceptions clouding judgement - the people saying Shakespeare isn't relevant and aren't interested in make reference to how bad his books are... He never wrote one.
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The Beans
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by The Beans » Thu Jan 01, 2015 7:25 am

lanky316 wrote:
The Beans wrote:For something to be "timeless" it has to stay truly relevant.

It just mean Shakespeare's works aren't suddenly going to become the books of choice for young teens.
Really, really bad example to use. For every fad that comes along there are still millions of copies of the Complete Works sold every year, with young people discovering and loving his work all the time. We see various versions of his stuff - whether played straight or an alternate take (The Lion King anyone?) - proving massively popular with every generation. School does it's best to suck the life out of it and sour young people on Shakespeare but it hasn't stopped it being relevant and popular with them and being discovered and enjoyed by youngsters all the time.

You do highlight the big issue under here though, that through our own perceptions we see things in one way and won't realise these things. If a kid only has any knowledge or understanding of certain things it's no surprise they won't necessarily embrace something new to them (even if in cases like this it's older) as they have zero knowledge, understanding or inclination to even try to. A great test case is the Amish, in your teen years you suddenly leave your sheltered life and experience all the real world with all it's mod cons and can choose to live that life or go back to their old life style. The vast majority go back having not been wowed by the things that in our minds are essential and failing to see what's so great about them.

As for our own perceptions clouding judgement - the people saying Shakespeare isn't relevant and aren't interested in make reference to how bad his books are... He never wrote one.
Nope, sorry, Shakespeare is an excellent example. If Shakespeare wasn't forced on kids at school the young would hardly bother with any of it at all. You're never going to see Shakespeare dislodge whatever the latest equivalents of Twilight or The Hunger Games currently are etc.
Giving modern re-interpretations a mention actually made me chuckle. The very fact that something has to be updated to re-enter popular culture proves it isn't timeless at all.
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lanky316
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by lanky316 » Thu Jan 01, 2015 7:42 am

What? How can you possibly say that, when it does still dislodge them? The negative aspects and perceptions developed in younger people are built on Shakespeare being forced on people (something some of us never move on from) builds the false perception. Shakespeare is something which is still essentially discovered in your own time. Whether that be in the form of watching the DiCaprio version of Romeo and Juliet on TV, a cartoon lion or in a theatre in olde worlde dresse that's when it's discovered and enjoyed, not really in school.

If you can tell me where the REAL changes are to re-enter culture I'd love to hear them however. 400 years ago he was adding random songs into productions or cute cuddly animals into roles and we're still doing the exact same thing. The Lion King may be a cute lion but it's still clearly the same old Hamlet, even including the incest element. If 400 years later millions of people are still choosing to see his work and discovering it for the first time it proves it is timeless. Giving Juliet a different hat won't make it not Romeo and Juliet.
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by gman72 » Thu Jan 01, 2015 9:06 am

lanky316 wrote:Giving Juliet a different hat won't make it not Romeo and Juliet.
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by koopa42 » Thu Jan 01, 2015 10:22 am

I always thought The Lion King was Star Wars, it has Mufasa's force ghost.

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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by nakamura » Thu Jan 01, 2015 3:28 pm

crusto wrote:
Iirc Super Mario World has 96 levels :P
Mario World has 96 exits, hence the red dots of the map representing a level with 2 and a yellow dot is a level with 1. The game has around 75 levels which is a massive amount still.

It's odd really. The box itself stated 96 levels. It's like the production art team didn't actually verify what the import game press were saying at the time!
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crusto
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Re: Dad makes son only play retro games for ten years

Post by crusto » Thu Jan 01, 2015 3:43 pm

nakamura wrote:
crusto wrote:
Iirc Super Mario World has 96 levels :P
Mario World has 96 exits, hence the red dots of the map representing a level with 2 and a yellow dot is a level with 1. The game has around 75 levels which is a massive amount still.

It's odd really. The box itself stated 96 levels. It's like the production art team didn't actually verify what the import game press were saying at the time!
That must be what I remember then. I did finish it all, and so presumed I had finished 96 levels.

Lying Nintendo asswipes!
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