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Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 1:48 pm
by martyg
abraxxious wrote: Doom is not a very good title to sell the merits of a console of this era as both the PSX and Saturn (and even Atari Jaguar, 32x etc) could handle a port of Doom..... if written correctly. :)
Not sure what you mean by "if written correctly" as if the Jaguar version needs special considerations to even be able to run Doom. Doom actually runs too fast on the Jaguar.

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:19 pm
by GameOver
Nemesis wrote:Unfortunately, despite what you've said above, a console (or computer) is only as good as the sum of its parts. You've listed all the supposed technical benefits of a Saturn over a PSX but that means very little in the real world.
This is spot on. I've written games on the PSX and Saturn and you can't compare hardware stats. For example, with one game the PSX could fit all the graphics in vram, and free up main ram, but on the Saturn there wasn't room as it's vram was split in two - you had to use DMA every frame to page in graphics to get the same result and then ended up with less main ram. There's no point in having something like higher bit depths on textures when there isn't the vram to use them. A machine has to be balanced. Having two CPU's is great in theory but the poor implementation meant performance was not very good after all the work to get the code cache friendly as it would still clash with other systems. The Saturn wasn't that hard to write for, the hardware was just too limited for a time when we were moving away from old-skool tiles/maps. If you wrote a game suited to the limitations of the machine, eg a balance of 2D and 3D or just 2D, then it was excellent but if your game wasn't... That's one of reasons why developers preferred the PSX as was a much more versatile machine.

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:27 pm
by gman72
Nemesis wrote:
abraxxious wrote:Hmmmm, either I missed something, or I am not as well versed in the English language as I previously thought. :)

If we are talking about the general quality of 3d games on the PSX vs Saturn, then the PSX is the superior console.

HOWEVER, if, as the thread title suggests, we are simply pitting the power and features of each console against the other, then the Saturn is the clear winner.

The Saturn MAY be a pig to program, but it does have the more powerful hardware.

Saturn has more system ram, more video ram, higher resolutions, high texture bit depth, more cpu power, more sound channels PLUS additional FM channels, faster CDrom and can easily be upgraded to double its system ram. This is not counting the 2d features where the Saturn REALLY runs rings around the PSX as well as the Neo Geo etc.

The PSX is easier to program and has some transparency effects, video and sound compression features built in.

Doom is not a very good title to sell the merits of a console of this era as both the PSX and Saturn (and even Atari Jaguar, 32x etc) could handle a port of Doom..... if written correctly. :) Saturn Doom was an absolute joke, PSX Doom was decent, so it wins by Default. Why not compare games that push the hardware more? Duke Nukem 3d is a considerably more complex game engine than Doom.... how does the PSX version compare to the Saturn? The only situation I could envisage that the much lower spec PSX could keep up with the Saturn (when properly utilised) is when rendered multiple transparency layers in realtime 3d. This could (and has) been done in software on the Saturn, but this would use up considerable cpu time, thus giving the PSX a chance to keep up with its lesser cpu power (since on the PSX transparencies are done in hardware independent of the cpu).

The other nice thing about the Saturn is that it had a much better build quality than the PSX, so whilst looking nicer it also lasts longer - none of those wearing out cdrom units on the Saturn.
Unfortunately, despite what you've said above, a console (or computer) is only as good as the sum of its parts. You've listed all the supposed technical benefits of a Saturn over a PSX but that means very little in the real world. It is not just about how powerful certain components of a machine are but how well they work together as a unit to produce the desired results. There was a reason (or several perhaps) why the Saturn was hard to program for and that was because the individual parts didn't talk to other easily. That's even before Sega shoved another Hitachi CPU processor in the mix to compound things further.

There's not much doubting that the Saturn was a 2D powerhouse but the elegance of Sony's designed hardware made it more efficient at 3D, nullifying any supposed power advantage Sega's machine might've had overall. You can always name one or two games that buck a particular trend or go against the grain. Sony's hardware was not supposed to be adept at 2D, yet was released with Rapid Reload and had a superior version of Castlevania SOTN compared to the Saturn despite additional content being added. The end product spoke volumes over tech specs on a sheet of paper and your post doesn't alter my view on that.
I could not agree more, Nemesis.
The Saturn may have had better specs on paper but when it came to games PSX ran rings around the Segas hardware on the whole. Not to say the Saturn didn't have any good games but as an entertainment in video gaming device history quite clearly shows that the PSX was the better machine.

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:00 pm
by The Laird
Hang on, I thought we were talking about the PS1 not the PSX :?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSX_(video_game_console)

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Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:04 pm
by gman72
Now you don't see many of those puppies about do you?

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:06 pm
by Nemesis
The Laird wrote:Hang on, I thought we were talking about the PS1 not the PSX :?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSX_(video_game_console)

Image
PSX was just the early name for what was to become the PS1 as far as I was concerned. It sounds cooler and old Skool too :)

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:35 pm
by gman72
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_(console)
Just read the first couple of lines. I was pretty sure the original grey slab Playstation was abbreviated to PSX way before the other (later) PSX came into existence. :D

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:40 pm
by Nemesis
gman72 wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_(console)
Just read the first couple of lines. I was pretty sure the original grey slab Playstation was abbreviated to PSX way before the other (later) PSX came into existence. :D
Yeah, I'm sure EDGE referred to it as the PSX in the early days.

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:48 pm
by The Laird
PlayStation, PlayStation 1 or PS1 is still the correct term for it :P

Not that I really care, because the Saturn is much better anyway :mrgreen:

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:15 pm
by gman72
OK, just so you're clear.
The original grey slab Playstation console was abbreviated to the PSX for convenience its full name being Playstation.
The PSone was the slim version of the Playstation. People sometimes call this console PS1 but iirc the official name was PSone.
To add confusion the PSX was the official name of the big, white, rare multimedia thing you posted above :D

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:27 am
by QwakAttak
Shameless fanboy bum-licking on thsi thread.. the very first post was despicible.. do you work for SEGA?

I had both in their day, and have both (with 60Hz modes) now. The PS1 absolutely annihilates the Saturn, though the Sega machine has some very good exclusive games.

You can pick holes in the PS1 all you like, comparing lighting in Quake and clutching at other straws.. but we all know it is just because the Sony machine was so popular and you Sega fanboys love to put down the winner and try to defend the underdog.. well it ain't working.

The PS1 is definitely in my top 3 consoles ever, and I'm currently playing it alot. The Saturn has about 10 games I absolutely adore, but the PS1 has a huge library of games that I still enjoy to this day.

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:55 am
by snowkatt
i doubt you will get an awnser from yethboth he hasnt signed in for years and the orginal post is from 2007

and what are you complaining about anyway ?
nemesis summed it up perfectly why the ps 1 was " better"

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:39 am
by retrosofer
QwakAttak wrote:Shameless fanboy bum-licking on thsi thread.. the very first post was despicible.. do you work for SEGA?

I had both in their day, and have both (with 60Hz modes) now. The PS1 absolutely annihilates the Saturn, though the Sega machine has some very good exclusive games.

You can pick holes in the PS1 all you like, comparing lighting in Quake and clutching at other straws.. but we all know it is just because the Sony machine was so popular and you Sega fanboys love to put down the winner and try to defend the underdog.. well it ain't working.

The PS1 is definitely in my top 3 consoles ever, and I'm currently playing it alot. The Saturn has about 10 games I absolutely adore, but the PS1 has a huge library of games that I still enjoy to this day.
Are you the man formerly known as Chiptune by any chance?

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:55 am
by QwakAttak
retrosofer wrote:
QwakAttak wrote:Shameless fanboy bum-licking on thsi thread.. the very first post was despicible.. do you work for SEGA?

I had both in their day, and have both (with 60Hz modes) now. The PS1 absolutely annihilates the Saturn, though the Sega machine has some very good exclusive games.

You can pick holes in the PS1 all you like, comparing lighting in Quake and clutching at other straws.. but we all know it is just because the Sony machine was so popular and you Sega fanboys love to put down the winner and try to defend the underdog.. well it ain't working.

The PS1 is definitely in my top 3 consoles ever, and I'm currently playing it alot. The Saturn has about 10 games I absolutely adore, but the PS1 has a huge library of games that I still enjoy to this day.
Are you the man formerly known as Chiptune by any chance?

The next time I have to edit your post due to your chosen method of insults, you will be banned from the forum. As a new member with warnings I suggest you tread lightly from this point onwards. MPM

Re: Sega Saturn Vs Sony Playstation 1

Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:38 pm
by nakamura
Whenever I see topics like this now I can't help but think, who cares. Both have awesome games and games are all that matter.