wii U

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retrosofer
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Re: wii U

Post by retrosofer » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:17 am

I agree that the WiiU will need more software to draw people in, its a shame the Rayman game got pushed back, but while things are slow, WiiU sales will pick up at some point i'm sure, nobody has got the spare cash so soon after Christmas to splash out on a new system. These days pricing and timing are everything, and i think Sony and MS will have the same slow sales of their systems too, especially if they are priced any higher than £300, and do silly stuff like make people pay silly prices for their own priority drives and such.

To be honest though Sony and MS have problems of their own at the moment. Sony's released the Vita and has left it to rot in the dark, the price of the system is a little too high, but the whole memory card debacle is and has put a great many off the system (myself included) more than anything, add to that the lack of software at the moment to. As people know Sony have many other financial problems to deal with to.
MS keep pushing the whole Kinnect thing still :roll: , even though the majority of gamers who have a 360 have given the peripheral the middle finger, its only in University's and tech/science labs that the Kinnect has been embraced, yet gamers can expect Kinnect 2.0 in the 720, yay, i guess... :? Add to this the Metro dash, adverts and long loading times for Gold member paying customers, where previously there was non on the NXE dash. With MS push of Win8 and Metro, Kinnect 2.0, and i can see why many would be excited about the 720, not.

Truth is Sony and MS face just as much of an uphill struggle in the next generation as Nintendo is facing now with their new console, previous years you could almost guarantee stuff, but now not so, times have changed, and with the prospect of more through-the-arse dlc and restrictions with the new consoles, MS and Sony might need a plan B to.

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Re: wii U

Post by Rayne » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:29 am

retrosofer wrote:Sony's released the Vita...add to that the lack of software at the moment
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Re: wii U

Post by Matt_B » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:42 am

snowkatt wrote:
slacey1070 wrote:The article in GameTM about the Wii-U was interesting. How disappointing both software and hardware sales have been.

Isn't it about time that Nintendo released a console that gave the punters what they want, rather than what they want to invent?
didnt they do that with the gamecube ?
Obviously not, seeing as the punters generally didn't want it. :wink:

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Re: wii U

Post by DreamcastRIP » Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:48 am

retrosofer wrote:Truth is Sony and MS face just as much of an uphill struggle in the next generation as Nintendo is facing now with their new console...
Nonsense.
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Re: wii U

Post by adippm82 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:03 am

I know they do have dubious ways of collecting data, but if the latest two weeks on the VG Chartz site are any indication at all, then the Wii-U is in very serious trouble, week ending 12th of January, 1,952 units sold in the UK, the next week, 1,421, with the total to date 104,000, mind you like I say, they will no doubt be adjusted in days to come to read a bit differently, but still to fall behind the Vita's abysmal sales is cause for real alarm I would have thought.

I have bought every Nintendo console on launch day since the Gameboy in 1990, both home and hand Held, but have absolutely zero interest in picking up a Wii U, vastly overpriced games at launch, plus the high cost of the system put me off initially, then to find out my old downloaded games from the Wii are tied to the system, not an account, 50hz VC titles, apparent poor battery life of the tablet, a save game transfer still two months away dulled any pangs of enthusiasm I had further, an almost total lack of interest in the games on offer, another 2D Mario at full price, no thanks, just nothing appealed to me about the Wii-U over it's predecessor, and I cannot see my feelings changing anytime soon, and this is from someone with 16 Nintendo consoles, and over 500 boxed, complete, and somewhat treasured games for them.
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Re: wii U

Post by retrosofer » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:07 am

Rayne wrote:
retrosofer wrote:Sony's released the Vita...add to that the lack of software at the moment
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Not really, memory stick debacle aside, the one thing i'm always hearing Vita owner talking about is the lack of games, that the system really need a new wave of releases and how Sony have kind of forgotten about the system. Its not like i just made it up, its just what i have heard a lot of Vita owners saying when they talk about the system, that its a great system, needing more games as its lacking just like the 3DS was. Sony should be pushing the hell out the system up until next PS, but they seem way to quiet.

As for the new MS and Sony systems, they are not going to be quantum leaps like previous generations, and they might suffer the same slow sales, not just because people feel less inclined to upgrade now days, but dependent on games, price, timing and other factors. The industry is a bit weird at the moment and has been for a while, what was a given yesteryear, is now patchy uncertain ground, i'm sure both companies were glad to see someone (in this case Ninty) take the plunge before them. Though its would be more about seeing how well a new system did in the current market all thing considered as WiiU isn't really Next Gen technically.

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Re: wii U

Post by Freestyler » Wed Jan 30, 2013 4:26 pm

I feel for Nintendo sometimes, but then again when they release a "powerful new HD console" and make one of the headline games available for it look like it was made for the original Wii then what do you expect?

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Seriously guys, does this screenshot scream "Next Generation Gameplay" to you?

If you were a mother of a child - and let's face it, we're all aware by now that non-magazine-reading parents make up the majority of Console/videogame purchasers - does this stand out to you? Or does it remind you of exactly the same game you bought years ago for the almost-identically-named console your son or daughter no longer plays on?

The Marketing guys at Nintendo need shooting. They did this with the 3DS too. So much so that I personally had to explain to the parents at my kids schools that the 3DS wasn't just some addition to the DS like the DSi camera, or a revised model like the DS Lite, but an actual upgraded console. Nintendo Marketing needs serious scorn poured on it by every self-identifying Nintendo fan. Defending Nintendo at this point is worse than the self-delusional Cult of Apple ever was.

So, you have your company's latest technology to sell? What do you do? Blanket advertise the device's wonderful new features using excitingly prepared and thrilling adverts, or do you just show the same shitty New Super Mario Bros Wii U commercial over and over?

You know, the one that looks like it's made for the original Wii. FOUR years ago?
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Re: wii U

Post by slacey1070 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 4:39 pm

Is it a cultural thing? Is it what the Japanese market expects?

In.fairness, that's not a great Mario shot and I think it looks better than in the photo.....

The only threat to both Sony and Ms blowing the Wii u away, is if they go down download only route.
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Re: wii U

Post by markopoloman » Wed Jan 30, 2013 8:55 pm

As a Wii-U owner (and someone that got the Wii at launch), I have to admit that Nintendo have ballsed this up BIG time. The amount of launch titles is diabolical. I thought it was great that Black Ops 2 was included in the launch lineup but the pricing is just completely stupid! Price points needed to be able to compete with the Eggbox360/PS£ - and only now do the sellers seem to be realising what a duffer they have stocked for, making prices drop.

Now that Mario can be purchased for £29.99 I have ordered it. What the Wii-U needs is something worth buying, something special.... Xbox get exclusive deals on games as does the PS3, so why Nintendo didn't try and grab something like Aliens: Colonial Marines as an exclusive for a month (just an example) is just adding to what is building into a terminal disaster.

Don't get me wrong, I love the system. Love Nintendoland, love Zombie-U - love the family get togethers. I really want it to succeed... and I hope Nintendo can dig it out before it is over too soon for them.
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Re: wii U

Post by hydr0x » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:51 am

Look, you're just beating a dead horse. No one disagrees that the post-launch line-up is horrible. What people disagree on is the consequences. The same people who predicted the death of the DS, Wii and 3DS pre-launch and post-launch are the ones now predicting the death of the Wii U, with the same silly arguments that have been proven wrong 3 times already. Three things to note:

1) It does not matter AT ALL in the long term that we are not seeing enough new games right now. The Wii U is not a September release, we are talking about January and February here. Christmas sales were just fine and you can bet that it'll be the same next Christmas/Black Friday/whatever. It also didn't have to launch against other new systems that could now be grabbing market-share during this drought. Anyone who thinks PS4 or the next Xbox will be here in 2013 is out of his mind. If that was the case, Sony/MS would have announced this and shown something right before the Wii U launch to steal its thunder and ruin its launch.

2) Because I've seen it mentioned several times: Wii U games are NOT more expensive than PS360 games at launch. The SRP of Black Ops 2 is exactly the same across all formats. Comparing Mass Effect 3 or Arkham City to the old and already reduced PS360 release is completely stupid. Every multi platform release to come will launch at the same price on all the systems. And New Super Mario is not more expensive than any other new game on any system either. It just doesn't drop in price as much, but that's because it will still sell just as well a year on without a price reduction, which just isn't true for something like Assassin's Creed III.

3) The Line-Up in general: Don't judge it by this laughable post-launch window. Nintendo actually apologized for this lack of games and not only promised it would get better soon but is already delivering in March with LEGO City Undercover, Monster Hunter 3, Rayman Legends and Scribblenauts with games like Game & Wario, The Wonderful 101, Pikmin 3, and Wii Fit U also definitely coming in the first half of 2013. Add to that the fact that we'll see playable Mario and Zelda games at E3 and that they (contrary to your claim markopoloman) HAVE secured exclusivity for hardcore titles (Bayonetta 2) and you'll realize that the complaints about the line-up will seem entirely silly soon enough. I mean, it looks that 18 month from now we'll have at least 2 Mario games, 1 Zelda game, Mario Kart, Pikmin 3, a Wario game, a "Party" game, a Smash Bros and a new Wii Fit out. Since when is that a bad start into a console's life? On the Wii and GameCube that was about everything you got during it's whole lifespan and now it's supposedly not even good enough for the first year or two? Jeez...
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Re: wii U

Post by DreamcastRIP » Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:25 am

Freestyler wrote:... Defending Nintendo at this point is worse than the self-delusional Cult of Apple ever was.
Well said! :lol: Not that they won't ever stop trying though. :wink:

Some of the posts I've read on forums are so desperate it's beyond them being 'just' Ninty cheerleaders. So disturbing is the scale of their delusion that we're now looking at what I'd term Ninty Fundamentalists, i.e. the extremist lunatic fringe of Ninty's fanboys.

I'll restate something I've said here before: I don't envisage Wii U being anywhere near as commercially successful as Wii was. Wii will be seen by historians as a temporary blip in the otherwise long and gradual decline of a once great company. Wii U will be another GameCube in the sense that it'll see Ninty return to third place in the home console wars. I imagine that following a price cut and the release of a proper Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart and/or The Legend of Zelda game that Wii U sales will pick up.

I just don't see the Wii U concept being embraced by the public to anywhere near the same extent as the Wii concept was. I'm not saying that with the benefit of hindsight as I stated as much immediately after the console was first unveiled and was roundly jumped on by the usual suspects here.

I sincerely hope Wii U succeeds to the extent that it has a decent selection of games that integrate GamePad functionality in a positive manner and that it sells well enough to keep Ninty in the game. I'd hate to see them exit the home console business as a manufacturer but I fear there's a realistic possibility of that happening. The success of Wii reversed the downward spiral of Ninty's home console business and if Wii U turns out like another GameCube then we could well be looking at an industry comprising of Sony and Microsoft. Maybe that wouldn't be entirely depressing though as the door would be open for another player to step up (Google/Apple/Valve/Nvidia/another). Ninty would then be free to release its games on more capable hardware thus allowing its talents to shine without being compromised by their own technologically backward hardware. Exiting the home console industry as a manufacturer could actually be a positive thing for Ninty and its games.

As much as I'd frown on the industry losing such a stalwart as a home console manufacturer it might just be the kick up the backside Ninty needs. The company has been dining out on past glories for too long and even its fans are now voicing concerns at the company's ever more tired approach in rehashing the same old same old IP. The 'New' of the New Super Mario Bros games is fast becoming a running joke, for example. Exiting the home console industry would force Ninty to re-evaluate their position and hopefully encourage them to rediscover what it was that once made them such a great company. No more tragically underpowered home consoles and no more gimicky concepts desperately trying to recapture the magic of Wii's one-off success. In place would hopefully be more great games to keep its fans happy, a greater focus on developing new IP, continued success in the handheld console market and ultimately them recapturing the magic they once had.

Do I think it likely though? Nope. I imagine Wii U will have done just about well enough by the end of its cycle (maybe 30-40m units sold) to justify Ninty having another go at releasing a new console. From a selfish point of view I certainly don't wish for Wii U to fail as I happen to own one and so would like to see some cool games on it over the next few years. For the time being though things aren't looking too healthy. Ninty fanboys have taken great pleasure in ridiculing Sony for PS Vita's abysmal sales but even that is apparently outselling the Wii U now. Fans bang on about it 'all being about the games'. Well,

* Aliens: Colonial Marines has been delayed for two months after the other versions have had it released
* Rayman Legends, as fun as it looks, is just a jazzed up version of a game that's been on sale since late 2011 which can be downloaded for under £5 on PC nowadays
* Pikmin 3 - the game many Ninty fans seemingly clamour for but, if the previous two games in the series are anything to go by, won't be the mainstream commerical success Ninty hope for
* Bayonetta 2 - the Wii U-exclusive sequel to the critcally acclaimed first game in the series that didn't sell particularly well at all
* Sacrilegium - a decent-looking survival horror effort but will it sell when ZombiU beat it to the punch?

No proper new Super Mario Bros (no lessons learned from the GameCube launch then), Mario Kart, Zelda, F-Zero, etc, game at launch and no word of when any of them will arrive. At the precise time Ninty need to be making headway with their new console in advance of the competition launching their respective new next-gen consoles things are looking very bleak indeed with little in the way of any grounds for optimism on the horizon - the console's upcoming game release schedule is largely a barren wasteland. That said, the company has a history of pulling rabbits out of hats when times are bad (Pokémon, for example) so I don't entirely rule out something unexpected happening again soon. It's very far from being 'game over' for Wii U but no matter what excuses the Ninty cheerleaders proffer the signs aren't great right now.
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Re: wii U

Post by markopoloman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 5:32 am

hydr0x wrote:Look, you're just beating a dead horse.
Oh no! I suppose we are going to find Wii-U parts in Tesco burgers now. :shock:

I agree partly with what you said hydr0x, but when you look at the games currently being developed for the system and see some big names missing, it just looks like some of the main companies have already pushed the Wii-U to one side. Maybe they are just waiting to see what happens? The launch of particular titles will cause a spike in sales - Pikmin 3 is one of those (I want it now!) but until something amazing turns up I can't see things improving a great deal.

Just to confirm, I want the Wii-U to succeed. I just think Nintendo need to step back, look at Microsoft & Sony's business plan and come out fighting as currently they are sitting on a stool in the corner of the ring, blood steaming from it's nose and a towel in hand..... waiting to be thrown in.

Come on Nintendo!
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Re: wii U

Post by slacey1070 » Thu Jan 31, 2013 5:50 am

markopoloman wrote:
hydr0x wrote:Look, you're just beating a dead horse.
Oh no! I suppose we are going to find Wii-U parts in Tesco burgers now. :shock:

I agree partly with what you said hydr0x, but when you look at the games currently being developed for the system and see some big names missing, it just looks like some of the main companies have already pushed the Wii-U to one side. Maybe they are just waiting to see what happens? The launch of particular titles will cause a spike in sales - Pikmin 3 is one of those (I want it now!) but until something amazing turns up I can't see things improving a great deal.

Just to confirm, I want the Wii-U to succeed. I just think Nintendo need to step back, look at Microsoft & Sony's business plan and come out fighting as currently they are sitting on a stool in the corner of the ring, blood steaming from it's nose and a towel in hand..... waiting to be thrown in.

Come on Nintendo!

I agree with this, I'd love to see Nintendo turn themselves around. And the fact that developers may be standing on the sideline waiting to see shows a lack of confidence in the system. I'll always remember EA refuses to back the Dreamcast and what damage that did to an otherwise excellent system.

A few posts have mentioned when the wii-u was launch - let us not forget, Nintendo made that decision - it wasn't forced about them.

The fact that people are saying "the vita doesn't have much software either" and "Rayman is on the way" are hardly comforting and sound a little desperate....

Nintendo, get a proper Mario out and a Mario Kart and give the Wii-U a fighting chance.. please.
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Re: wii U

Post by adippm82 » Thu Jan 31, 2013 5:51 am

hydr0x wrote:
Because I've seen it mentioned several times: Wii U games are NOT more expensive than PS360 games at launch. The SRP of Black Ops 2 is exactly the same across all formats. Comparing Mass Effect 3 or Arkham City to the old and already reduced PS360 release is completely stupid. Every multi platform release to come will launch at the same price on all the systems. And New Super Mario is not more expensive than any other new game on any system either. It just doesn't drop in price as much, but that's because it will still sell just as well a year on without a price reduction, which just isn't true for something like Assassin's Creed III.
When I first saw the Wii U in stock in game, there was just one title under £40, Nintendoland at £39.99, every single other one was well over £40, Zombie U, £44.99, Black ops 2 £42.99, (reduced by £5), Batman £47.99, Darksiders II £49.99, this is way more than I would be willing to pay personally for multi format games, that are technically inferior to the ones on other systems, and the latter two, never cost that when they were released on the other systems new, so if they are compared to each other when they actually launched, the Wii U version was more expensive, I paid £37.99 for Batman, the day after launch.

Assassins Creed III is currently ten pounds more than it's Xbox / PS3 cousins on Game's website, so not only was it more expensive at launch, it is still more expensive now, yes people will go on about small user base and all that, but having games ten quid more than your rivals is not going to cure that, plus people used to the prices of Wii games are hardly going to be inspired to upgrade their console.

Yes, many of these are cheaper than they were, but I would bet good money that it is because they simply are not shifting.

As for Mario still selling well in a years time, it is not selling well now, sitting outside the top 200 on Amazon's all format chart is not good, there are no Wii U exclusives in Chart Tracks top 40 all formats at all, just a few short weeks after launch.

I have posted on here against the doom and gloom of the 3DS, which with a change in direction proved the nay sayers completely wrong, as I knew it would, despite the best efforts of the Sun and their abysmal stories that the console was going to blind the entire country, but the Wii U is different, the lack of excitement generated from it's launch was obvious, certainly where I come from, I know no-one with one.

Like I posted above, Nintendo should be worried if a long standing customer of over 22 years is not interested in their product, and I would put money on it that I am not alone, I am personally fed up to the back teeth with 2D Mario games, I have left Super Mario Bros Wii and New Super Mario 2 on the 3DS on the shelf, and the prospect of yet another similar title on the Wii U is not going to cut it for me anyway.

Will a new Zelda shift big console numbers, I am not sure, there will be a spike as Marcopoloman says when the fans snap it up, and as Dreamcast posted, Pikmin 3 certainly will not, I love the series, but they sold in small numbers before, despite their undoubted brilliance, the Lego game looks good, System seller, not sure, and I have seen so many times on the internet now, from the fanatical masses, that Nintendo have secured third party exclusives, but usually just list Bayonetta 2.

The Wii's appeal was that it got everyone together to actually physically compete with each other, the Wii U for me takes a step back away from that sort of fun, shame.

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Re: wii U

Post by markopoloman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:01 am

Actually, thinking about the Wii and it's launch, Wii Sports.

Wii-U needs Wii-U Sports and it needs to be as good or better than the original... and would need to be priced sensibly. That would cause a spike in the sales.
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