Retro Gamer Issue 112 - Feedback Thread

[kleinemaus]

Wow, that was so potent, it postes twice

[Darran@Retro Gamer]

. It's quite possible that they did not know that Pengo was even available for these systems.

That is no excuse and only makes Retro Gamer look bad.

Do you know everything there is to know about videogames then?

[the_hawk]

Correct, an earlier nic was Atari Classic, but nowadays A8 is the overall term for the Atari 8-bit range of computers. So it should have been mentioned that Pengo was avaiable on cartridge for te Atari XL. It happened previous with Rally Speedway, and numerous times before in previous issues concerning other 8 bit titles. It is not acceptable.

So every time a game is mentioned every singe version on every single machine has to be mentioned too?

Pfffffffffft - Gawd help RG if they feature Space Invaders or Pac Man again or it'll take up the entire mag.

[r0jaws]

I'll hazard a guess that the Atari 8 bit computers were probably not mentioned in either article because they were quite a small feature in the UK market. I know for a fact that I didn't even see one until I started to attend retro shows in the UK. It's quite possible that they did not know that Pengo was even available for these systems.

Did you know it was the second largest selling import 8-bit computer in the UK and as a whole range it sold more units than the Amstrad CPC?

I didn't know that, but in my defence I didn't know anyone, when I was a kid, who owned an 8 bit Atari (or at least they didn't let on). I don't remember seeing them in the shops, I don't remember any advertisements on the TV or on posters or in magazines, and I don't remember systems or games being displayed in the shops. But then that could be down to the fact that I was focussed on my Speccy.
However, I'm not sure I went around with blinkers on as I do remember tons of stuff about, BBC Micros, Commodores, Electrons, and CPC's because I had mates with them and saw them advertised and in the shops all over.
It could be a regional thing though, I was in Sussex. Maybe they were more prevalent elsewhere?

I also don't want to pick apart your point, because it's quite an interesting one, but what systems are included in the whole range? I mean it's a bit unfair to stack one computer against say 3-4.

@kleinemaus, I can see you're passionate about A8's, double post passionate, but I think it's a bit much to expect any human being, or even any publishing entity, to be infallible about all aspects of any subject.
My respect for the writers and researchers hasn't dropped (much) after learning of the error's and omissions kindly pointed out after every issue by the hawk eyed, and highly knowledgeable patrons of this fine publication. So I'm sure they will survive.

[The Laird]

I also don't want to pick apart your point, because it's quite an interesting one, but what systems are included in the whole range? I mean it's a bit unfair to stack one computer against say 3-4.

There are a lot of computers in the Atari 8-bit range: 400, 800, 600 XL, 800 XL, 1200 XL, 65 XE, 130 XE, 800 XE and XEGS (I think that is all of them). But its not like they are totally different computers, they are all basically the same computer with different cases and RAM configurations just like you had the different versions of the Spectrum. The biggest problem for the A8 was that its life started in 1979 (and was produced until 1992), years before its competitors. This meant it had quite a fragmented user base and software houses had to choose what the lowest RAM configuration they were going to support. One of the most interesting things about the A8 range compared to any other 8-bit computer was the amount of cartridges it had meaning it could be used pretty much as a console (of course the XEGS was a console just with an attachable keyboard) or as a serious computer. It was more successful in America, Eastern Europe (especially Poland) and Germany than it was in the UK but still had significant worldwide sales.

[Spector]

There are a lot of computers in the Atari 8-bit range: 400, 800, 600 XL, 800 XL, 1200 XL, 65 XE, 130 XE, 800 XE and XEGS (I think that is all of them).

That's a hell of a lot of systems; you'd need a huge box just to say what it was compatible with. It's obvious why Atari software didn't get released to anywhere near the same level as the big three micros in the UK due to the potential confusion caused. I remember sscott- one of the biggest Atari 8-bit whores on this forum- saying to me that he'd walk into John Menzies and find 100 games for the Spectrum, 100 for the C64, 70-80 games for the Amstrad... and 5 Atari cassettes stuck in the bottom corner! It's a shame, because I've been playing some Atari 8 bit homebrews these past few years and it's a fine machine with a great colour palette. Pity the cassettes took 3 hours to load.

[CraigGrannell]

Pfffffffffft - Gawd help RG if they feature Space Invaders or Pac Man again or it'll take up the entire mag.

Quite. Looking at the referenced example, I don't see that as an error—it's just pointing out some of the conversions. When space is restricted, you have to put in whatever you can make fit. It'd be a bit different if, say, a making-of concentrated on a C64 game when the original was done on the A8, but that doesn't happen in the mag.

[kleinemaus]

. It's quite possible that they did not know that Pengo was even available for these systems.

That is no excuse and only makes Retro Gamer look bad.

Do you know everything there is to know about videogames then?

Second time you asked me that. Actually, I used to live in Bournemouth during the 80s, and I was a member of the BaPAUG (the famous Bournemouth and Poole Atari User Group in case you're wondering) and co- founder of UKs award winning fanzine 8: 16. Shame I don't live in Bournemouth anymore, I certainly would come knocking for a job concerning all things Atari.

[kleinemaus]

There are a lot of computers in the Atari 8-bit range: 400, 800, 600 XL, 800 XL, 1200 XL, 65 XE, 130 XE, 800 XE and XEGS (I think that is all of them).

That's a hell of a lot of systems; you'd need a huge box just to say what it was compatible with. It's obvious why Atari software didn't get released to anywhere near the same level as the big three micros in the UK due to the potential confusion caused. I remember sscott- one of the biggest Atari 8-bit whores on this forum- saying to me that he'd walk into John Menzies and find 100 games for the Spectrum, 100 for the C64, 70-80 games for the Amstrad... and 5 Atari cassettes stuck in the bottom corner! It's a shame, because I've been playing some Atari 8 bit homebrews these past few years and it's a fine machine with a great colour palette. Pity the cassettes took 3 hours to load.

At least they loaded AND WORKED

[mikeb]

@kleinemaus ~ I think most reasonable people don't expect the mag to list every existing format for every title, it would make the mag very tedious to read and ugly to have walls of text listing systems on every page... On the Making of Rampart I listed most (not all) of the platforms because they simply woudn't all fit*, and even then the sub shortened them. I'd actually rather have more captions in the mag than complete lists of platforms personally (it's annoying to see screenshots of games and not know what they are or what system they are on). And imagine having to do this say every time a game like Manic Miner is mentioned**... So apologies to anyone if fave or valued systems are omitted elsewhere but it's just not practical to have everything. After all where would you put it?

*Arcade, Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, Commodore 64, PC DOS, Game Boy, Game Boy Color, Sega Mega Drive/Genesis, Atari Lynx, NES, SEGA Master System, Super Nintendo zzzzzz....

** Sinclair ZX Spectrum, BBC Micro, Commodore 16, Commodore Plus/4, Commodore 64, DOS, Dragon 32/64, Amiga, Amstrad CPC, Game Boy Advance, iPad, iPhone, MSX, Oric 1, Sam Coupe, Memotech MTX, PC Windows, Windows Phone, XBox 360, Samsung bada, Android smartphone... ack sorry we're out of space for the feature.

[TMR]

That's a hell of a lot of systems; you'd need a huge box just to say what it was compatible with.

There were a couple of quirky programs out there that needed specific machines, but generally speaking the games just had to say they wanted an Atari Home Computer and specify how much memory they'd need.

[Darran@Retro Gamer]

Second time you asked me that. Actually, I used to live in Bournemouth during the 80s, and I was a member of the BaPAUG (the famous Bournemouth and Poole Atari User Group in case you're wondering) and co- founder of UKs award winning fanzine 8: 16. Shame I don't live in Bournemouth anymore, I certainly would come knocking for a job concerning all things Atari.

I've lived in Poole and Bournemouth all my life and I've never heard of the supposedly famous BaPAUG. Was it a group of just you? I've never heard of your fanzine either, probably because it covered systems I had no interest in (Atari Systems were rare where I lived). I'd certainly like to see it if there are any PDFs available. We could do a feature on your fanzine and other ones. I think that would make for a very interesting read.

On another note I think Atari fanboys are wired up differently to everyone else, as they just can't seem to ever let anything go

[The Laird]

At least we stick to the facts unlike Nintendo fanboys

[Darran@Retro Gamer]

At least we stick to the facts unlike Nintendo fanboys

Well I wouldn't go that far. It's like Animal Farm. All retro fanboys are nerds, some are just nerdier than others

[kleinemaus]

Second time you asked me that. Actually, I used to live in Bournemouth during the 80s, and I was a member of the BaPAUG (the famous Bournemouth and Poole Atari User Group in case you're wondering) and co- founder of UKs award winning fanzine 8: 16. Shame I don't live in Bournemouth anymore, I certainly would come knocking for a job concerning all things Atari.

I've lived in Poole and Bournemouth all my life and I've never heard of the supposedly famous BaPAUG. Was it a group of just you? I've never heard of your fanzine either, probably because it covered systems I had no interest in (Atari Systems were rare where I lived). I'd certainly like to see it if there are any PDFs available. We could do a feature on your fanzine and other ones. I think that would make for a very interesting read.

You're joking right?
You have heard of The Computer Shop, in Parkstone, 329 Ashley Road? It always had loads of Atari 8 bit software for sale. Huge shelf full. You heard of The Computer Cavern in Reading? It had loads of Atari 8-bit software for sale. Oh wait, most UK computer gamers only went to Boots, WHS or Woolies to pick up some run-of-the mill Spectrum tape game.
The BaPAUG was formed when Atari users split from the BACC (Bournemouth Area Computer Club), as the Atari became more popluar. You heard of the BACC I hope. If not you're not from Bournemouth at all.

Yes you can see 8: 16 here, at some time it was so popular, we sold it via the newsagents in Poole and Parkstone:
http://s630.photobucket.com/albums/uu25/voltageman321/
under sub albums