Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

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Stevearcade
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Stevearcade » Sat Jul 02, 2011 3:45 pm

Video Games is a small and Nintendo's success (all be it in other territories) no doubt heavily influenced other areas of the market, even where they were not number one. If we're interested in the history and development of video games, few companies are more important than Nintendo. But if it makes you happy, let's have less Nintendo love for a while and more stuff about Jet Set Willy!

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DreamcastRIP
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:28 pm

Stevearcade wrote:Video Games is a small and Nintendo's success (all be it in other territories) no doubt heavily influenced other areas of the market, even where they were not number one. If we're interested in the history and development of video games, few companies are more important than Nintendo. But if it makes you happy, let's have less Nintendo love for a while and more stuff about Jet Set Willy!
Yep, I don't doubt Nintendo's importance alongside certain other companies in the history of video gaming and I enjoy reading the articles in the RG magazine. Equally, like others have also said, it's a question of proportion and balance. Spread the love RG!
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martyg
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by martyg » Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:45 pm

Mayhem wrote:Conversely Atari are not without similar, in hindsight, crazy decisions. Like not taking Nintendo up on helping to market and distribute the Famicom (to be the NES) in the US... how things could have been different if it had said yes...
Not exactly what happened, covered that in my 7800 article.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Mayhem » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:13 pm

DreamcastRIP wrote:But the "any specific region", as you put it, happens not to be just any old region. It happens to be THIS region, i.e. the one where by far the greatest amount of people buying the RG magazine live (to the best of my knowledge). What was popular in the USA has little or nothing to do with this discussion so I have no idea why you referenced Sega in that context.
Personally I don't care about regions. So what if Nintendo weren't as popular as Sega in Europe during the late 80s? They were the dominant force everywhere else in the world, and hence what laid the foundations for today. By that virtue we should have barely anything in the magazine post Megadrive for Sega because Sony primarily, and Nintendo, were much more successful than it.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:28 pm

Mayhem wrote:
DreamcastRIP wrote:But the "any specific region", as you put it, happens not to be just any old region. It happens to be THIS region, i.e. the one where by far the greatest amount of people buying the RG magazine live (to the best of my knowledge). What was popular in the USA has little or nothing to do with this discussion so I have no idea why you referenced Sega in that context.
Personally I don't care about regions. So what if Nintendo weren't as popular as Sega in Europe during the late 80s? They were the dominant force everywhere else in the world, and hence what laid the foundations for today. By that virtue we should have barely anything in the magazine post Megadrive for Sega because Sony primarily, and Nintendo, were much more successful than it.
Only "during the late 80s"? Try carrying that over into the early '90s too. Mega Drive only truly exploded in popularity once Sonic The Hedgehog was released, which was in mid-1991. :wink:

Nintendo "were the dominant force everywhere else in the world"? Er, no they weren't.

What "foundations" do you speak of? Not another Nintendo Seal of Quality tale, please!

Why the continued obsession with mentioning Sega? I sincerely hope it's not because you assume that by me having a Sega-related username I must therefore be anti-Nintendo as I assure you that is not the case. :)
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Mayhem » Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:27 am

You really do need to reread what I write... I said "so what if Nintendo weren't as popular as Sega during the late 80s", not that Sega were only popular during the late 80s. Out of the three main regions of Europe, Japan and US, are you seriously going to tell me that Sega had any decent market share in the latter two while the NES/Famicom was out? If you do, you're bloody deluded. By "foundations" I mean the basis of what Nintendo was built upon and the reasons why they continue to be successful today. And I mentioned Sega because they were the only really contender to Nintendo during the 80s, and why you disputed that having "30 years of success" because not all that time had been to do with Europe.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:32 pm

Mayhem wrote:You really do need to reread what I write... I said "so what if Nintendo weren't as popular as Sega during the late 80s", not that Sega were only popular during the late 80s. Out of the three main regions of Europe, Japan and US, are you seriously going to tell me that Sega had any decent market share in the latter two while the NES/Famicom was out? If you do, you're bloody deluded. By "foundations" I mean the basis of what Nintendo was built upon and the reasons why they continue to be successful today. And I mentioned Sega because they were the only really contender to Nintendo during the 80s, and why you disputed that having "30 years of success" because not all that time had been to do with Europe.
Why start with hostility and borderline personal insults? Totally unnecessary and uncalled for.

Paraphrasing the nature of your response then... You really need to reread what you write! Your original wording was,

"... were the dominant force everywhere else in the world",

not,

"Of the three main regions of Europe, Japan and US...",

as you're now seeking to redefine things. Whether you meant that in the first place is immaterial - you should have been more precise in the first place, if so.

The reason I sought to make that 20 years/30 years distinction would I hoped have been obvious. The thread relates to RG magazine. Nintendo were pretty much nothing in the UK prior to GameBoy relative to the popular company they are now on these shores. You said earlier, "Personally I don't care about regions" so by your rationale the RG magazine should be brimming with articles about games from overseas never released in the UK that the overwhelming majority of the readership couldn't give two hoots about! :roll:
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Mayhem » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:52 pm

Hostility? Hmmm... Mr Kettle, please meet Mr Pot here...

Maybe unlike many people, I'd much rather read about things I don't know about rather than things I do. Retro Gamer does cover that quite well. But that isn't what I meant. As I mentioned, by the same virtue then, there shouldn't be anything Sega in the magazine post Megadrive because the Saturn and Dreamcast were minority formats in the UK by comparison; ergo because it was only a successful company in Europe for a few years, and not worldwide at all. Evidently, and thankfully for us, plenty of people disagree with that particular opinion and stance. Sure Retro Gamer is a UK published magazine, but it is sold elsewhere and it certainly doesn't have a UK only freelance writing pool. Saying Nintendo hasn't been a successful company for 30 years simply because it wasn't huge in Europe during the 80s would be like saying Microsoft hasn't had any success with the Xbox consoles because it's not been that popular in Japan. Or that Atari wasn't with the 2600 because it didn't make an impact likewise in the same territory.

The conclusion is... I don't give a toss about your blinkered opinion. Nintendo has been a successful company since the early 80s to me, in the same way that Sega has, to a varying degree across the same period. The fact both are still operative is testament to that fact.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:55 pm

Mayhem wrote:Hostility? Hmmm... Mr Kettle, please meet Mr Pot here...

Maybe unlike many people, I'd much rather read about things I don't know about rather than things I do. Retro Gamer does cover that quite well. But that isn't what I meant. As I mentioned, by the same virtue then, there shouldn't be anything Sega in the magazine post Megadrive because the Saturn and Dreamcast were minority formats in the UK by comparison; ergo because it was only a successful company in Europe for a few years, and not worldwide at all. Evidently, and thankfully for us, plenty of people disagree with that particular opinion and stance. Sure Retro Gamer is a UK published magazine, but it is sold elsewhere and it certainly doesn't have a UK only freelance writing pool. Saying Nintendo hasn't been a successful company for 30 years simply because it wasn't huge in Europe during the 80s would be like saying Microsoft hasn't had any success with the Xbox consoles because it's not been that popular in Japan. Or that Atari wasn't with the 2600 because it didn't make an impact likewise in the same territory.

The conclusion is... I don't give a toss about your blinkered opinion. Nintendo has been a successful company since the early 80s to me, in the same way that Sega has, to a varying degree across the same period. The fact both are still operative is testament to that fact.
Summary of the above:

Opening paragraph:
* Seeks to increase pointless self-induced conflict further by progressing from making aforementioned petty, unprovoked and wholly unnecessary personal insults onto a new tactic of blatant trolling with some minor childish name-calling chucked in for effect.

Second paragraph:
* Continue previously established trend of wilfully misunderstanding what other user has said.
* Seeks to grossly distort and misrepresent what has been previously stated by other forum member to serve own ends.
* Refuse to engage in rational debate as the facts presented inconveniently don't coincide with own distorted personal opinions.

Closing paragraph:
* Resumption of making aforementioned wholly unnecessary personal insults with no rational foundation.
* Additional erroneous observation chucked in that bears no relation to the nature of the ongoing debate thus serving to further highlight a lack of appreciation of what said debate entailed.

Thank you. :roll:
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Mayhem
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Mayhem » Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:57 pm

You do realise I've had PMs stating that I'm a saint for putting up with you this long, hmmm? :P

Brief summary of above...

Opening paragraph: baseless accusation and a complete denial of the truth that you fail to register anything that you are saying, attempting to play the sympathy card to all and sundry (nice try, everyone sees through it). No one's ever called me a troll before, I must be doing something wrong, shock horror!

Second paragraph: continues previously established trend of wilfully misunderstanding what other user has said, and forever punctuates his opinion as fact, regardless of the blatant truth he is wrong.

Closing paragraph: resumption of making baseless accusations, making a post that has no bearing on the discussion at all, and persuades people that he couldn't see an luminous pink elephant wearing a tutu even if he was standing right in front of it.

Concise summary of the entirely of your above: troll to the nth degree.

Double summary of the above: awaiting the lock because there's no way I'm ever going to get through your thick, retarded skull.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:17 pm

Mayhem wrote:You do realise I've had PMs stating that I'm a saint for putting up with you this long, hmmm? :P
Oh, and I can well imagine who sent those supposed PMs too! :roll:

I quite ably managed to hold civil debates with others in this thread but in your case you had to go and turn things into a confrontation. The posts are there to speak for themselves assuming you don't now go and edit what you've posted. I note another member, martyg, also called you out on your revisionist manner of retelling history too. Regarding your closing personal insult and act of continued aggression I see I'm the second member of this forum you've used it on in recent times.

Note that I'm no longer responding to your incessant trolling, continued personal abuse, increasingly wild accusations, inability to accept fact and ever more childish name calling.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Mayhem » Sun Jul 03, 2011 11:53 pm

Boo hoo, cry me a river... Jagfest deserves somewhat of an apology, and I have discussed things in the past with him, so we know where we stand. You, are entirely a different kettle of fish...

As for MartyG, yes I'd forgotten that his 7800 article had put a better interpretation of events regarding Atari/Nintendo, and I'm quite willing to hold my hands up and say that what was previously thought to be an accurate picture wasn't quite so clear cut, and what my brain had been referencing at the time of posting.

But I'll continue to insist that to consider Nintendo have "only" a 20 year run as a successful company purely because Retro Gamer is a UK based magazine and because it wasn't a prominent force in the UK during the 80s is entirely blinkered and delusional...
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:20 am

Mayhem wrote:But I'll continue to insist that to consider Nintendo have "only" a 20 year run as a successful company purely because Retro Gamer is a UK based magazine and because it wasn't a prominent force in the UK during the 80s is entirely blinkered and delusional...
That sentence doesn't make sense.
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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by Rory Milne » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:19 am

Wow, some really passionate arguments there guys, I'm sure you'll bury the hatchet at some point down the line when the red mist has cleared. :)

As a complete neutral on the less Nintendo / reasonable amount of Nintendo RG content point I did notice that over the last year issues with a strongly Nintendo related cover (N64, Secret of Mana, Donkey Kong Country Returns, Mario) have sold out.

Well ok the Axelay issue hasn't (maybe appeals more to Treasure fans than Nintendo fans?) and neither has the Rare one (might be because they're with Microsoft now?) but what it does point to is that Darran and Stuart really know what they're doing in terms of selling the mag by featuring covers / large articles that attract additional / casual buyers while offering varied content to hopefully please everybody else inside.

Personally I'm just really pleased the mag is selling well (no copies left some months) as that should help guarantee its future. :D

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Re: Can we have less Nintendo love for a while

Post by DreamcastRIP » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:20 pm

Rory Milne wrote:Wow, some really passionate arguments there guys, I'm sure you'll bury the hatchet at some point down the line when the red mist has cleared. :)
We've done so already via PM. :D
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