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Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:18 pm
by TwoHeadedBoy
So, Mr. TMR,

IF the homebrew section DOES get that extension (which would be very much welcomed here anyway), would you consider doing "Special Things", aside from news and reviews? Such as examples of "Classic" homebrew things, or a making-of on Cave Story/interview with Daisuke Amaya? That'd be a very nice thing to read.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:54 pm
by TMR
TwoHeadedBoy wrote:So, Mr. TMR,
Uh-oh... people don't usually call me Mr. unless i'm in trouble!
TwoHeadedBoy wrote:IF the homebrew section DOES get that extension (which would be very much welcomed here anyway), would you consider doing "Special Things", aside from news and reviews? Such as examples of "Classic" homebrew things, or a making-of on Cave Story/interview with Daisuke Amaya? That'd be a very nice thing to read.
Well, the classic homebrew thing is something i've personally liked the idea of for a while so if it works for Darran and Stuart i'm more than up for it. Doing making ofs for homebrew... hmm... have to give that one a little more thought but it's always a possibility.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 6:58 am
by joefish
Is this viable as occasional special features, rather than making the homebrew section permanently bigger? Would that attract less criticism and maybe interest more people who wouldn't otherwise read it?
Personally I've always thought of the 'Homebrew' section as just the two page spread of retro platform reviews - I wasn't counting the remakes and interviews section. Maybe that could be more integrated into what the rest of the mag does?

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 7:09 am
by CraigGrannell
Unless I'm having a senior moment, hasn't the mag already had making-ofs on homebrew? I'm pretty sure I recall that multiplayer JSW getting one.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 8:01 am
by Jet Pilot
joefish wrote:Is this viable as occasional special features, rather than making the homebrew section permanently bigger? Would that attract less criticism and maybe interest more people who wouldn't otherwise read it?
The homebrew section already gets 4 pages in every issue. That's plenty of space for a feature that many readers...according to the editors themselves...skip right over. If I wanted a magazine filled with homebrew games I would've subscribed to that sort of publication. I read Retro Gamer because I want to read about retro games. 4 pages is plenty to cover this side-topic that really only has a very slight association with retro gaming (just because a game plays on an old console doesn't meant that it's a retro game...it's just a new game that plays on an old console).

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 8:11 am
by the_hawk
So how many magazines are there that are "filled with homebrew games?". A hell of a lot less than are filled with Mario features I'll wager. :wink:

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 9:20 am
by Jet Pilot
the_hawk wrote:So how many magazines are there that are "filled with homebrew games?". A hell of a lot less than are filled with Mario features I'll wager. :wink:
No idea, because that isn't my interest. :)

And there has been roughly 244 pages of homebrew coverage since Imagine took over the magazine vs. zero for an iconic franchise such as Mario. Hardly a valid comparison. 8)

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 9:40 am
by Eric
Drop lets play / ebay / retro shamer.

Full page for collectors corner.

End game / Boss Rush updated - drop the humour from both and give more in depth detail of the endings & bosses.

Game related adverts only - if possible only include adverts which are game related eg. latest game releases etc.

Expand news, retro booty, old vs new & letters pages.

Game to movie comparison feature, eg Mario, Double Dragon, Prince Of Persia & even Street Fighter and the latest Tekken. Compare the storyline & characters against the original game with screenshots from both.

"Back to the..." - alternate cinema charts with the music charts. Change the background image of the aged brown paper, contrasts too much with the nice clean glossy overall image of the mag.

Don`t overlap screenshots with xbla/psn/sizzler stickers.

Add colour/update the staff image drawings or even restrict their use to the "Loading" title page.

More retro box art & adverts scattered around features etc.

More interviews with game creators talking more in depth about how / what tricks were used when making their games.

Covers - keep with the bright and pixely format, these really stand out on the shelves and lets you now instantly what the mag contains.

Retro cheats boxouts included in game features.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 10:01 am
by necronom
Jet Pilot wrote:there has been roughly 244 pages of homebrew coverage since Imagine took over the magazine vs. zero for an iconic franchise such as Mario.
Like I said a while back:

"I think we had a 6 page Mario/Nintendo feature in issue 16 called "King Mario", a 2 page Super Mario World piece in Issue 23, issue 31 had 2 pages on Super Mario Cart and another 2 on Super Mario Bros 3, issue 32 had 2 pages on Super Mario Land. I don't know what there has been since issue 33 as I haven't indexed those.

I think there has been plenty of Mario."

And merman added:

"that list should include the Mario Kart article (8 pages), a couple more double-screen shots and a couple of Boss Rush features."

So I get that to be about 28 pages of Mario in about 10 separate feature/articles.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:17 am
by merman
necronom wrote:
Jet Pilot wrote:there has been roughly 244 pages of homebrew coverage since Imagine took over the magazine vs. zero for an iconic franchise such as Mario.
Like I said a while back:

"I think we had a 6 page Mario/Nintendo feature in issue 16 called "King Mario", a 2 page Super Mario World piece in Issue 23, issue 31 had 2 pages on Super Mario Cart and another 2 on Super Mario Bros 3, issue 32 had 2 pages on Super Mario Land. I don't know what there has been since issue 33 as I haven't indexed those.

I think there has been plenty of Mario."

And merman added:

"that list should include the Mario Kart article (8 pages), a couple more double-screen shots and a couple of Boss Rush features."

So I get that to be about 28 pages of Mario in about 10 separate feature/articles.
Spread over SIXTY ISSUES in FIVE YEARS. I'll let individuals decide if that is a good thing or a bad thing.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:33 am
by Timothy Lumsden
isnt all this getting a bit specific about more/less Mario etc?

for me as long as each issue has a lot of variety - maybe more sections but shorter - people probably wouldnt get so het up about too much mario/axelay etc.

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:08 pm
by Jet Pilot
necronom wrote:"I think we had a 6 page Mario/Nintendo feature in issue 16 called "King Mario", a 2 page Super Mario World piece in Issue 23, issue 31 had 2 pages on Super Mario Cart and another 2 on Super Mario Bros 3, issue 32 had 2 pages on Super Mario Land. I don't know what there has been since issue 33 as I haven't indexed those.
The current publisher is Imagine, so anything prior to that is not applicable and Mario Kart is not a Mario platformer last time I checked.

The Super Mario World "feature" you mention was a 2-page screen-shot blurbs (which I like, but it hardly constitutes a feature). So, those other two features are the only two Mario features that have been in the magazine for a total of 4 pages of content (out of about 6200+ pages of content since Imagine picked up the magazine).

It's pretty disappointing that you consider a whopping 4 pages of content to be "plenty" of coverage for the franchise that helped pull the entire home console gaming industry back from the brink. Just because you don't like a particular franchise doesn't mean that franchise doesn't have a huge significance to the gaming industry as a whole and should be ignored by the definitive magazine on the retro gaming topic.

There's lots of stuff that gets cover in Retro Gamer that I could care less about having never played it (although I still find much if it interesting to read as it broadens my view of the industry as a whole), however I won't deny that a lot of those games are significant just because they don't interest me. Any fair-minded person would do the same. 8)

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:38 pm
by necronom
Jet Pilot wrote:
necronom wrote:"I think we had a 6 page Mario/Nintendo feature in issue 16 called "King Mario", a 2 page Super Mario World piece in Issue 23, issue 31 had 2 pages on Super Mario Cart and another 2 on Super Mario Bros 3, issue 32 had 2 pages on Super Mario Land. I don't know what there has been since issue 33 as I haven't indexed those.
The current publisher is Imagine, so anything prior to that is not applicable
Why not? It's still retro Gamer. If they get a different staff member do we have to then not count anything before that, or if the change address? I don't see what difference that makes, as we are talking about something appearing in the magazine called Retro Gamer, which started at issue 1.
Jet Pilot wrote: and Mario Kart is not a Mario platformer last time I checked.
I don't understand this either. Who mentioned platformers? You keep mentioning that Mario hasn't been IN ANY PAGES of RG, when clearly has - about 28 of them.
Jet Pilot wrote: The Super Mario World "feature" you mention was a 2-page screen-shot blurbs (which I like, but it hardly constitutes a feature). So, those other two features are the only two Mario features that have been in the magazine for a total of 4 pages of content (out of about 6200+ pages of content since Imagine picked up the magazine).
That's interesting maths there! You selectively miss out ones depending on the building it way typed in, then ignore others that you aren't bothered about and end up with 4 pages instead of 28 :lol:

You could discount the 2 page mini review things, but it's still closer to 28 than 4!
Jet Pilot wrote: It's pretty disappointing that you consider a whopping 4 pages of content to be "plenty" of coverage for the franchise that helped pull the entire home console gaming industry back from the brink. Just because you don't like a particular franchise doesn't mean that franchise doesn't have a huge significance to the gaming industry as a whole and should be ignored by the definitive magazine on the retro gaming topic.
Well, I disagree strongly on the 4 pages, and I don't think the world would have ended without Mario existing, as here in the UK we never had any problems with game being available, and I didn't even notice Mario at the time, as it had no impact on me in any way.

The only reason I mentioned it at all, is because you constantly mention Mario not ever having appeared in the mag, when he clearly has on multiple occasions. That's all. I wasn't trying to start an argument, just trying to put some balance to what was said.

Also, isn't everyone sick to death of constant Mario this, Mario that, being pushed into our faces, constantly, for ever, constantly...
Jet Pilot wrote: There's lots of stuff that gets cover in Retro Gamer that I could care less about having never played it (although I still find much if it interesting to read as it broadens my view of the industry as a whole), however I won't deny that a lot of those games are significant just because they don't interest me. Any fair-minded person would do the same. 8)
There is loads in RG that I've never played. In this issue there are massive features on Axelay and the motorbike one (which I can't remember its name at the moment). I had no idea what they were, but I don't mind reading about them, it's just that I'm bored to death of Mario, and I've never even played a Mario game (apart from Donkey Kong).

Doesn't everyone interested in Mario, already know everything about it?

I'll try not to mention it again. :)

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:57 pm
by TwoHeadedBoy
Mr. Jet Pilot,

You have to get it into your head that Retro Gamer is a UK mag. The USA is not the centre of the universe - however popular the little bugger is over there, it doesn't mean it works out exactly the smae in the rest of the world. It's all well and good expanding the content to make international readers happy, but this doesn't mean taking on the exact same mindset as most Americans seem to have of the history of gaming (Everyone has a NES, Atari killed gaming etc).

And as Necronom said there - if you're really bothered about Mario, you probably know everything there is to know already.

Alright?

Re: Improving the magazine

Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 6:18 pm
by SqueakyG
Re: Mario coverage.

Issue 23: Super Mario World - Retrorevival (2 pages)
Issue 31: Super Mario Kart - Retrorevival (2 pages)
Issue 31: Super Mario Bros 3 - The Classic Game (2 pages)
Issue 32: Super Mario Land - The Classic Game (2 pages)
Issue 37: The Top 25 Platformers of All Time - Super MArio 64 (half-page), Super Mario Bros 3 (half-page), Super Mario World (1 page)
Issue 52: Super Mario Bros 2 - Retrorevival (2 pages)
Issue 55: Super mario World - Pixel Perfect (2 pages)
Issue 60 - Mario Kart series - The Complete History Of... (8 pages)
Issue 61 - Super Mario Bros series - Boss Rush (Bowser) (1 page)
Issue 72 - Super Mario Land 2 - Boss Rush (Wario) (1 page)
Issue 75 - Dr Mario - Retrorevival (2 pages)

Plus numerous Retro Rated reviews of new Mario releases such as New Super Mario Bros (DS), New Super Mario Bros (Wii), Super Mario Galaxy, Super Mario Galaxy 2, etc.


So lots of little things, but there has never been a proper "Making Of...", "Complete Lowdown", "The Definitive..." or "The Complete History Of..." the core Super Mario platform games.

The question is: do we need one? These games must be so over-exposed. Anyone reading the magazine must already know enough about the history of the series, and know enough about the design ethics of Shigeru Miyamoto. I mean come on, who doesn't already know the story of why the Jumpman sprite was designed with a moustache, cap and dungarees? Who doesn't know that Mario was named after Mario Segale, the landlord of Nintendo of America's warehouse? I'm sure there are some fascinating secrets you've never heard, but getting them out of Japanese developers is not likely.